Wont be able to play football on whats left of that knee

[BloodRedLion]

It seems like a big stretch to think that Eddie wanted to be a football player himself.

[RaiTwo]

Isn't something like this said on "The making of Silent Hill 2" DVD, and by art director Masahi Tsuboyama?

"This corpse is James himself! Same face, same
polygonal model structure. In fact, this is an image
straight out of James' imagination."

Another image from James' brain...

I think they also confirmed that the victims in the meat locker were James as well, but I guess that can be confirmed with a pair of eyes as well.

[alone in the town]

It seems like a big stretch to think that Eddie wanted to be a football player himself.

Why?

[Mr Pat]

If everything in Silent Hill 2 appears different from person to person (Angela - Fire. Eddie - People laughing at him. Laura - Empty Town. James - Monsters.) Why would Eddie's hopes and dreams be visible to James? If the town is very personal to everyone else, it doesn't make sense to me that James would be able to see Eddie's desired self, much like Eddie can't see Pyramid Head, James' desired punisher.

[alone in the town]

When the characters are in proximity, their personal touches and influence overlap, and one can see elements of the other superimposed upon their own Silent Hill. It happens several times and with each of the characters, with the possible exception of Laura.

[Sionnan]

Hmm...

The Jameses in the meat locker add onto James subconsciously wanting himself dead. Although James says he doesn't want to kill himself, it goes along with the delusions he's already created for himself.

[Mr Pat]

I don't know, James never sees the fire until he himself kills in self defense (Eddie). James never sees the people laughing nor does Eddie or Angela ever see Pyramid Head (although one could make the argument that they weren't ever in the same place as Pyramid Head). I mean, in the room Angela sees her father while you see a grotesque monster.

[Sionnan]

... Uhm.

What?

James sees the fire because at that point Angela's delusions are so strong, they go past the point of being subjective and become projective due to the power of the town. :/ It seems that when you reach a certain point or trauma or crazy, you can project your hurt on other people. (Alessa and Walter anyone?)

James saw the meat locker. It's obviously not actually inside the jail, but it was what Eddie saw. People were just worthless hunks of flesh.

James was simply not as far down the path as the other two. That's why no one ever saw what he did.

And Eddie never saw Pyramid Head because he had no idea what the hell James was going on about, even when he gave him the fairly accurate description of "Red Pyramid thing".

So the reason why James sees himself as all those dead corpses is because JAMES's subconscious is exerting control over his conscious mind.

(And James doesn't see fire when he kills in self defense. :/ Please get your facts straight. You're mixing up Angela and Eddie's illusions.)

[alone in the town]

Hmm...

The Jameses in the meat locker add onto James subconsciously wanting himself dead. Although James says he doesn't want to kill himself, it goes along with the delusions he's already created for himself.

I personally think those bodies are more indicative of the fact that Eddie not-so-subconsciously wants James dead. The showdown had been building up for awhile, after all. Even Eddie knew it. After all, it can hardly be argued that any of the 'corpses' died by their own hand or will.

It probably is also worth noting that we don't know how much of James' delusion is visible to Eddie and Angela, as they might simply not decide to comment on the change, or might possibly not recognize any significant difference at the time (as we may not, the first time we play).

[Mr Pat]

The only time James sees the fire is later in the game when he sees Angela (after killing Eddie). We're just going to have to agree to disagree on why James sees the fire though. Get your facts straight. Because why now after James sees Angela for the first time he is able to see the fire when he normally couldn't? If the fire is always there for Angela, what made her finally become strong to project it to James?

Eddie didn't just see hunks of flesh, Eddie says HIMSELF he saw people laughing at him. As for him not seeing Pyramid Head b/c James didn't give him a good description... Come on, you can do better than that. If you saw a man wearing a giant red pyramid helmet you would be confused if someone said, "Red Pyramid Thing?"

[Sionnan]

Sorry, Mr. Pat. I came across as a big douchebag. A lto of this is open to people's interpretations, and yours is just as viable as mine. I misread the fire part, that you had said it was present with Eddie.

As for Pyramid Head- well, no. "Red" and "Pyramid" pretty well would lead me to remember what I just saw, if I had.

As for Angela being able to project it- you'd agree that the game got more intense for James? That everything he had constructed started to crumble? If it got similarly more intense for the other two, you'd assume that the strength of their emotions (and mental sanity) would correspondingly affect their environment.

As for the hunks of flesh- again, I guess it would be open to interpretation. I'd say at that point James is pretty well in Eddie's world.

Anyway, I apologize. I was tired, and ticked at something else when I wrote my other post. I shouldn't have taken my anger here.

AITT- See, I had wanted to say before that maybe James was somebody that Eddie wanted to kill from the beginning, especially with James in the fridge. >_>

And yeah, you're right to say it's not clear how much James projects onto the others,

[Mr Pat]

Don't worry about it Sionnan, the game is open to people's interpretations, and that's one of the reasons I love this game.

Yes, I would agree that towards the end everything started to get more intense for the two. But yeah, it is open to interpreatation.

Don't worry about it sir, we've all been there before.

[alone in the town]

If the fire is always there for Angela, what made her finally become strong to project it to James?

A sense of purpose, or perhaps her proximity to closure. Both Eddie and Angela, in earlier encounters, project small pieces of their world upon James. In the final encounters, both characters project it full-on, to where it more-or-less completely overtakes James' perception for the duration of the encounter. In the end, James himself finds his previously faulty perceptions displaced by new perceptions better reflecting the realities he has come to understand.

[ValtielInvoked]

The guy in the fridge is not Eddie.

In fact I don't even think Eddie killed him,whoever he may be. I think he just came into the room and started vomiting at the sight.

It's likely that Pyramid Head killed that man. Just as you find the man sitting dead in the chair in front of the TV...PH was behind that too. You see him behind the bars glaring at you just after the deed is done.

[macrodeath]

The body in the fridge of the room that you meet eddie in, there is also a bedroom right next to the bathroom that you fibd eddie puking his brains out in.It has football magazines,posters, a helment.
Does this mean that Eddie did kill the man it the fridge?

That's kinda horrid thing to say, even for Eddie. Just imagine your kneecap being shattered to pieces by psychomaniac. Gave me shivers. And about the guy in the fridge:
I thought that he is been dead for a while and when Eddie found him, he got sick. He's a person, that Eddie didn't kill, and he dind't see, or hear him making fun out of Ed, so he saw him as a normal human corpse, instead of smiling, laughing monster, making fun out of him. I mean, i just figured out Eddie's nightmare world from the part where Ed tells James that "they're allways laughing at me".
I don't know, i just felt that way about it...

[alone in the town]

The guy in the fridge is not Eddie.

In fact I don't even think Eddie killed him,whoever he may be. I think he just came into the room and started vomiting at the sight.

It's likely that Pyramid Head killed that man. Just as you find the man sitting dead in the chair in front of the TV...PH was behind that too. You see him behind the bars glaring at you just after the deed is done.

Pyramid Head kills no one who isn't named Maria. There's no proof or precedent arguing otherwise. And no one's suggesting that the fridge body is literally Eddie. The body is a metaphor that is explained in considerable detail above.

[Koshercrackers]

It could be possible that the football regalia in the bedroom are there to remind Eddie of what he's done. He's still mostly sane at this point, remember? He takes abuse from Laura at the bowling alley, and while I admit that this might be because he could have qualms about killing children, or perhaps that his psychosis comes in fits and starts, I think he can still interact with others without going apey. Going with this, I think that the football stuff is there to induce guilt in him, and to drive him further towards the edge of madness.

[Mephisto]

>also Eddie might have wanted to be a football player himself
Bingo!

>He's still mostly sane at this point, remember?
No. Eddie probably shot the guy 'cause he tought it was one of the cops or whatever, he wanted to hide the corpse but there wasn't a good place so he tought about the refrigerator: Another reference on his "fat self".

The room with all the football stuff is to make Eddie feel bad (in my view). That room shows that Eddie will never be able to play football and all that shit...

>He takes abuse from Laura at the bowling alley, and while I admit that this might be because he could have qualms about killing children, or perhaps that his psychosis comes in fits and starts.
Or perhaps he didn't even wanted to pay attention on what she's saying... "Hey Eddie let's go after her!" "Huh? Laura...? But why...?" Laura didn't wanted Eddie around her way, so probably he didn't care about her or what she was talking...

[Jonipoon]

>Pyramid Head kills no one who isn't named Maria.
Yes, he can kill James.

It's true though, that PH is not the murderer in this case.

[alone in the town]

>Pyramid Head kills no one who isn't named Maria.
Yes, he can kill James.

It's true though, that PH is not the murderer in this case.

That's just a gameplay mechanism. James dying at the hands of Pyramid Head is clearly not supposed to happen.