Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

James got a letter. From a dead person. Oh dear.

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Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Herr Shaun »

I've been thinking about this one for a while, but I finally got the nerve to post it. I often have trouble expressing myself through writing, and It's my first time presenting a theory, so although I welcome any and all criticism, please keep those things in mind when responding.
___________________________

The idea is this: Angela is actually trapped in a loop. She has repeated the events we catch a glimpse of during the game many times. When we meet up with her at the beginning of the game, she is determined to find a way out and finally break the cycle.

Here's what we know about Angela:

- It is heavily implied that she was molested by her father.
- She stabbed her father to death in the living room of their home, according to the newspaper in the Labyrinth.
- She is looking for her mother.

Let's analyze each scene individually and delve into the details:

Scene 1: Graveyard
Our first encounter with Angela. She is in a graveyard crouching in front of a gravestone. When James meets her, she reveals that she's looking for her mother, and warns him that something's wrong with the town.

There's not much we can infer from this scene, other than that Angela already knows about Silent Hill, which suggests that she has been through it before, in her own way. (Tom "The Adversary" has a great theory about Angela's "otherworld" being rooms in her house. This theory was written in line with it.)

Scene 2: Mirror Room
In our second encounter, we find Angela lying in front of a mirror, staring at her own reflection as she holds a knife. A somewhat awkward conversation ensues, in which Angela and James admit that their respective searches have turned up nothing. At the end, Angela asks James to hold onto the knife she's holding, but screams and brandishes it when he approaches it. She runs out of the room and disappears for a very long time.

This is where things start to get interesting. The conversation begins with James, who assumes Angela has the knife because she's suicidal. She doesn't really deny it outright, though she does act dismissive at the thought. Later, she asks James to hold the knife for her, because "if (she) kept it, (she's) not sure what (she) might do". On the surface, it sounds like Angela may indeed be suicidal, but critical examination suggests something different - she is afraid that she will repeat the events that led her here to begin with.

It's safe to assume that the knife that Angela gives James is the same one that was mentioned in the newspaper clipping in the Labyrinth - the one that she used to repeatedly stab her father to death. If James has the knife instead of Angela, she will have nothing to murder her father with, and figures she will thereby prevent the cycle from recurring. She will create a new path and be free.

When James is about to take the knife from Angela, she screams and points it at him. The very act of James approaching terrifies Angela beyond belief, which helps to illustrate just how profound an effect her trauma has had on her. This ties in very well with the next scene.

Scene 3: Labyrinth
In the third and most visceral encounter, we hear Angela crying out in fear from down the hall. She is implied to be in a room with her father, who is about to abuse her once more. James bursts into the room, where he finds a grotesque monster about to force itself on Angela. He manages to subdue the monster, after which Angela angrily kicks it and breaks a TV over its body. She then accuses James of having ill intentions himself, and accuses him of cheating on his wife before exiting.

This scene, although mostly designed around driving the point home that Angela was molested, contains an extremely important detail that is easy to miss. If you pay close attention to the Abstract Daddy monster at the end of the boss fight, you'll find that it's not actually dead and is still (barely) alive. James doesn't actually kill it - he only wounds it. When he goes to help Angela up, she flies into a blind rage. Overcome with emotion, she completely disregards her ambition up to this point, and furiously kicks the crap out of the beast she perceives to be her father. When the TV comes crashing down on its body, it is only then that the monster finally stops moving.

Angela then reflects on what's she done. Giving the knife to James didn't help at all - she simply found different means to the same end. She has failed, and realizes she must endure the events that led her here all over again. With no other outlet for her grief and frustration, she lashes out at James and her emotions become unstable. She storms off and we don't see her again until the ultimate scene...

Scene 4: Burning Staircase
We meet Angela for the last time in an impossibly-placed burning staircase, in which she confuses James for her mother. Initially relieved, she is taken aback to find that it's just him instead. She half-heartedly thanks James for saving her, and then proceeds to blame herself for everything that has unfolded. She asks James for the knife back, which James refuses. She walks up the burning staircase and vanishes.

When Angela mistakes James for her mother, her phrasing is a little confusing at first: "I've been looking all over for you. You're the only one left. Maybe then, maybe then I can rest." At face value, it sounds like Angela is scheming to murder her mother, since she's "the only one left". I don't like this idea, because:

- Angela is extremely overjoyed and comforted to see James when she thinks he's her mother. We already know how strongly Angela exhibits her emotions from previous encounters (eg. her anger when she's stomping her father to death). There is no reason to doubt the veracity of her reaction, so it would be equally implausible to assume this is someone she plans to kill.
- Looking back to the second encounter, Angela gives James the knife she presumably used to murder her father, because she feared "what [she] might do". If murdering her mother was really her plan, then why would she give away her only weapon?

Instead, I believe Angela is looking for sanctuary, and/or another way out of her situation. The only constant between these loops is that she still hasn't found her mother, which we can infer based on the fact that Angela feels the need to mention it to James, and her reaction when she finds James. Even though she failed her original task, she may still find salvation in her mother, hence "maybe then I can rest". However, it all goes to pot when she snaps out of it - she's back at square one, having repeated the same events yet again. All she can do now is blame herself for letting it happen ("Mama was right, I deserved what happened"). Defeated, she disappears up the burning staircase, uttering the famous last words that seal the deal: "For me, it's always like this."

To sum up...
Angela is caught in a loop and seeks to break free. She figures if she doesn't murder her father this time around, she may be able to walk free. However, the impact of her trauma is too much for her to bear and she ends up killing her father anyway. She seeks one more chance at redemption through her mother, who is nowhere to be found. Defeated, she walks up the burning staircase, doomed to repeat the process all over again.
___________________________

What do you think? As I said, I'm open to any and all criticism. I will probably need to fine tune a little bit here or there, but I just needed to get it on the page.
Last edited by Herr Shaun on 10 May 2022, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Vixx »

Herr Shaun wrote: 10 May 2022 I've been thinking about this one for a while, but I finally got the nerve to post it. I often have trouble expressing myself through writing, and It's my first time presenting a theory, so although I welcome any and all criticism, please keep those things in mind when responding.
You're with friends, so never hesitate from posting theories here! ❤️
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Herr Shaun »

Vixx wrote: 10 May 2022 You're with friends, so never hesitate from posting theories here! ❤️
Thank you Vixx! I really appreciate you keeping the site going so I had an outlet to do so. :)
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Burning Man »

Thanks for sharing. When I read this, it reminded me of the "James is in purgatory" theory. That one, too, has a protagonist stuck in a loop, but it was more about James coming to terms with what he had done and moving on in one way or the other. The theory was sometimes used to cleverly explain how all the endings could be canon.

Angela has two other scenes which may be relevant. They're both in the intro and easy to miss since they don't appear in-game. Angela is running through a corridor in one scene. It resembles the apartments somewhat, but I don't remember there being windows in the hallways. In the following scene, Angela is seen turning toward someone in surprise or annoyance in what appears to be the forest. This second scene can be thought-provoking as we never see who that is.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by The Adversary »

>Angela is running through a corridor in one scene.<
Pretty sure that's supposed to be her running through her house after she's killed her family. That's how I've always interpreted it, at least.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Droo »

Did she kill all of them or just Thomas?
"Oh yeah, I've been here before
I can see it with eyes closed
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Lives in the mirror"
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by The Adversary »

It's implied she killed her father and brother.

"I'm looking for my mama. . . . I mean my mother. It's been so long since I've seen her. I thought my father and brother were here, but I can't find them either. . . . I'm sorry. . . . It's not your problem."

I've always taken that as her acknowledging both Thomas and her brother are dead and she's looking for her mother, who blamed her for the assault(s) on her, to kill her too. Especially with her saying, "Even mama said it — I deserved what happened."
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Droo »

That means Mrs. Orosco may still be alive since I don't think Angela found her.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Burning Man »

If Angela's brother is indeed dead, I think she would have killed him in between her meeting with James at the graveyard and their subsequent meeting at the apartments. It would certainly explain how her mannerism has completely changed.

I don't think Angela would have killed him pre-arrival to Silent Hill. The impact of guilt would lessen if Angela had killed several people already. The fact that the newspaper only mentions Thomas also suggests that her brother did not share the same crime scene.

There are several theories on why Angela is seeking her mother. Personally, I think Angela's mother died some time ago. I've theorized that Angela's family was a happy one at one point. Then something happened that split the family apart. It's possibly around this time that Thomas became drunk and violent as well. By finding her mother, Angela thinks she can go back to how things were before.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by The Adversary »

>If Angela's brother is indeed dead, I think she would have killed him in between her meeting with James at the graveyard and their subsequent meeting at the apartments.<
I'm not sure about that. While I don't think her brother was killed at the same time as her father, I think it was before she got to Silent Hill. That's why she says she thought both her "father and brother were here" — especially when saying it in a graveyard.

Not to mention the fact she tells James on the fiery staircase, after mistaking him for her mother, "Now you're the only one left." Strong implication, to me, that she killed both her father and brother.

Can anyone confirm the date of the newspaper(s) found before the Abstract Daddy fight? I vaguely remember James saying it's "today's date" but I can't find it in the playthrough online.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by NanayaShiki »

The Adversary wrote: 14 Aug 2022 Can anyone confirm the date of the newspaper(s) found before the Abstract Daddy fight? I vaguely remember James saying it's "today's date" but I can't find it in the playthrough online.
Yep. The line you're thinking of about it being "today's date" is for the ones scattered over the floors and walls right outside the boss room, directly after the one you actually get to read. Technically one could argue they're not necessarily the same article but I believe the implication is clear that they are. The murder in question took place the previous night. Of course it's also possible it's not a "real" newspaper article but something that has manifested from/for Angela.

Either way, there's no mention of the brother but I agree that it's pretty clear she also killed him and intends to kill her mother and most likely then herself.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by The Adversary »

>Yep. The line you're thinking of about it being "today's date" is for the ones scattered over the floors and walls right outside the boss room<
That's what I thought. Thanks!
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Burning Man »

I'm not sure about that. While I don't think her brother was killed at the same time as her father, I think it was before she got to Silent Hill. That's why she says she thought both her "father and brother were here" — especially when saying it in a graveyard.
I think it should be one major event that causes the person so much guilt and shock that they are called to Silent Hill. Even the game seems to suggest that subsequent killings numb the person's guilt. This is shown through both Eddie's rampage and James' rather calm attitude after killing him. For Angela to have killed Thomas, then waited to kill her brother before coming to Silent Hill...

There's also the question regarding motivation. I realize it's a popular theory that Angela's brother also abused her, but in the labyrinth dialog, Angela refers to only one "he," which we presume is Thomas.
"You don't have to lie! Go ahead and say it! Or you could just force me. Beat me up like... he... he always did. You only care about yourself, anyway! You disgusting pig!"
So, the motivation to kill her brother is not clear. Angela obviously detests all men, but I don't think she intends to kill them all. Otherwise, we would have had an Angela boss fight.

I've wondered if Angela's story would be more effective without the brother.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by NanayaShiki »

Burning Man wrote: 15 Aug 2022
I'm not sure about that. While I don't think her brother was killed at the same time as her father, I think it was before she got to Silent Hill. That's why she says she thought both her "father and brother were here" — especially when saying it in a graveyard.
I think it should be one major event that causes the person so much guilt and shock that they are called to Silent Hill. Even the game seems to suggest that subsequent killings numb the person's guilt. This is shown through both Eddie's rampage and James' rather calm attitude after killing him. For Angela to have killed Thomas, then waited to kill her brother before coming to Silent Hill...

There's also the question regarding motivation. I realize it's a popular theory that Angela's brother also abused her, but in the labyrinth dialog, Angela refers to only one "he," which we presume is Thomas.
"You don't have to lie! Go ahead and say it! Or you could just force me. Beat me up like... he... he always did. You only care about yourself, anyway! You disgusting pig!"
So, the motivation to kill her brother is not clear. Angela obviously detests all men, but I don't think she intends to kill them all. Otherwise, we would have had an Angela boss fight.

I've wondered if Angela's story would be more effective without the brother.
There's no evidence that her brother sexually abuse her but we can extrapolate based on the surrounding evidence that she didn't view him particularly fondly. It was an overall abusive family in multiple ways. It's already a very common thing for victims of abuse from a parent to blame the entire family for letting it happen to them but in this instance we know that her mother wasn't just allowing it to happen, she said that Angela deserved it. We don't have many details on her brother but what we do have tells me that Angela's goal was to kill her entire family. I honestly don't know how else to interpret the line "Mama, I was looking for you. Now you're the only one left. Maybe then I can rest."

I know someone who grew up in this kind of abusive household and there's no set rulebook for how it's going to play out or how their trauma will manifest. Keep in mind that Angela is very much a broken person. She's both homicidal and suicidal but to really understand her story we still have to approach it with a significant amount of empathy because before all of that she was a victim.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Droo »

Maybe the Bloober SH game is from Angela's POV rather than a remake as rumoured.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Burning Man »

NanayaShiki wrote:It's already a very common thing for victims of abuse from a parent to blame the entire family for letting it happen to them but in this instance we know that her mother wasn't just allowing it to happen, she said that Angela deserved it. We don't have many details on her brother but what we do have tells me that Angela's goal was to kill her entire family. I honestly don't know how else to interpret the line "Mama, I was looking for you. Now you're the only one left. Maybe then I can rest."
I don't think Angela went to Silent Hill to kill her mother, simply because her mannerisms toward Thomas and her mother are in total contrast. It makes sense for Angela to kill someone she despises, but killing someone she loves very much seems contradictory.

The photo we find in the apartments where we meet Angela is torn down the middle, and separates the father and brother from the mother and daughter. Metaphorically, we can surmise that Angela wants to be with her mother but not with Thomas and her brother. Angela killed Thomas in a very gruesome manner, obviously fueled by hatred for him. We assume that her brother met a similar fate. In the staircase scene, however, Angela looks extremely happy, almost with a child-like innocence, when she believes that she had finally reunited with her mother.

But regarding that particular line, there is a concept in Japanese suicide culture that may tie in with the overall theme - [oyako shinjuu] meaning parent-child suicide.

This is further categorized into [boshi shinjuu] for mother-child suicide and [fushi shinjuu] for father-child suicide. Generally, it's the parent who kills the offspring and then kills themselves, mainly because the offspring isn't mature enough to decide that. [boshi shinjuu] may apply to Angela and her mother. Angela may believe that she will be happy if her mother can put her to rest.

On a related note, the dialog that says Angela's mother said she deserved what happened reads slightly differently in the Japanese script. Accordingly, Angela's mother still seemed to have known about what was happening, but the "I deserved what happened" part sounds more like Angela blaming herself. It does not say that her mother said those things. I like the Japanese version better because it somewhat relieves her mother from being an abuser as well, but more of a helpless by-stander.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by NanayaShiki »

Well for one thing I don't think there's nearly enough evidence for you to say that Angela loved her mother very much. Her reverting to a "childlike innocence" especially doesn't mean anything because she does that constantly. Her personality is very stunted and she reverts to a more childlike state many times in the game, including when she's flashing back to her abuse. She's a very traumatized person. I think using this one example of her doing this to not be related to her trauma but a genuine positive reaction is kind of cherry picking. I also think things like that interpretation of the photo is a stretch. Her father was the one abusing her so her reaction is of course going to be more direct with him.

Second thing I want to address is the notion of the Japanese line being different. So, I'm not fluent in Japanese or anything but I am somewhat fascinated by translation. I've never done my own research into differences in the script. But I have looked into them in other games where this sort of thing comes up. Japanese is a much vaguer language that I think is easier to twist the meaning of with translations that place emphasis in certain ways. But ultimately I see no reason to distrust the official translation. It's the only dub of the game for one thing, so we don't even have delivery to base anything off of with the Japanese one. So my interpretation of the scene is exclusively based off the official translation, not any fan translations out there.

My read on Angela has always been that she intends to kill her entire family, including herself. She's a very broken person though and the situation she lived through was extremely traumatic. Admittedly it's hard for me not to look at it through the lens of the real life people I know who have been through that but I know that emotions for other family members from an abusive household is... really fucking complicated. Angela is very inconsistent in a lot of ways throughout the game. Her reaction to her knife is a clear example of that.

There's a lot of missing information admittedly. Hell the scene that establishes she's looking for her mother also says she expected to see her father and brother but you can read that in two different ways. Was she looking for them in Silent Hill? Or the graveyard specifically? Does that scene imply she isn't acknowledging they are dead or directly referencing that they are? For all we know her brother could have already been dead. His only reference is being lumped in with her father here as "I thought they were here too". She also says that she hasn't seen her mother in a long time and then later seems to confirm that she lives in Silent Hill to James, which presumably Angela does not. So to me it seemed like her mother left her behind in an abusive household.

Really for me it's just the line "You're the only one left. Maybe then I can rest." I honestly don't know how else to take it.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by The Adversary »

>Really for me it's just the line "You're the only one left. Maybe then I can rest." I honestly don't know how else to take it.<
Especially when it's prefaced with the word "Now." We know her father was killed, and we know she has a brother who we don't see throughout the game, but with this one line we can establish he was likely killed, as well, and that Angela's intention with her mother is pretty clear.

Here's a thread I created a long time ago regarding Angela and her Otherworld. It has some nice points, though I haven't thought much about its veracity, though I do like still agree with it. It's worth a read, anyway: https://silenthillforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=60

Interesting to note is that the official Silent Hill 2: Novelization uses this theory as canon—that Angela's Otherworld is her house, and that she killed both her father and brother. It wasn't published until 2006, whereas my theory was written in 2005.
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Re: Angela is caught in a loop [Theory] (SPOILERS)

Post by Herr Shaun »

I saw that Tom had replied to my thread and my heart jumped into my throat, lol.

I'm happy to have inspired some discussion about this. I'll just assume that there being no objections is because the theory is actually all right!
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