The baby carriage?

Cypres · Post by **Cypres** » 24 Aug 2009

Since everything in this game has symbolism. I was wondering what do think the baby carriage in the empty pool, surrounded by the 3 monsters, that holds the snake coin means?

Post by **King Crimson** » 24 Aug 2009

Wasnt it a shopping cart?

Post by **stopped_clock** » 24 Aug 2009

King Crimson wrote:Wasnt it a shopping cart?

The pistol was in the shopping cart. I don't remember what was at the swimming pool though. I always just ran in, grabbed the coin and ran away again.

Cypres · Post by **Cypres** » 24 Aug 2009

heres a pic.

Post by **Jeklinhyd** » 24 Aug 2009

Yes, you retrieve the snake coin from a baby carriage in the pool. I don't yet know why.

Post by **SH3girl32** » 24 Aug 2009

Maybe it has something to do with who lived there before. I have no idea what that could mean.

Post by **stopped_clock** » 24 Aug 2009

I think to understand the significance of the pram you'd need to know the symbolism of the snake coin. I don't know what the coin itself means, but if, for instance,

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it represented Maria, then the pram could be seen as representative of her "birth" which would be occuring at about that time over in Heaven's Night.

Post by **alone in the town** » 24 Aug 2009

The swimming pool is empty, resembling the empty life of a man who has lost his wife, his happiness, and a good portion of his sanity. The carriage symbolizes the hope he feels, the hope that drives him to follow the letter into town. This item of hope is guarded by a group of monsters, symbolizing the dangers he must face before he reaches his goal. Upon reaching the carriage, he finds a coin inside, adorned with a snake, which perhaps indicates that James will find what he seeks, only to be met by a dangerous secret (Room 312).

If that's not enough overanalysis, I have another: The carriage symbolizes Maria: A carriage is designed for a baby: New life, new start, a birth (from a wish, hint), but it contains a snake, which in the Bible carries loads of metaphorical weight. It is a serpent who deceives Eve to eat of the Tree of Knowledge, leading her to learn of unpleasant things and be ejected from Heaven (possibly the shattering of delusion? A reference to Silent Heaven?)

Hell, you can take this to be a double-strength indicator of the Leave ending: Not only will eating of the Tree of Knowledge lead one out of (Silent) Heaven, but the pool is conspicuously empty. On top of that, the reference to Maria being the Snake, and the connotations that Rebirth is not desirable (the symbol of birth hiding the snake/Maria (the snake) being reborn repeatedly)--

The whole god damn thing is a huge-ass neon sign that says LEAVE ENDING.

Good night, everybody.

Post by **King Crimson** » 24 Aug 2009

Wow, thats an amazing theory AITT. I Prefer the second theory much more.

A snake is born from a wish. I beleive the pool represents james empty mind. Whether it used to be full of his sanity or it used to be filled with thoughts of happiness. Either way those two things are gone in one way or another.

Considering James has not even met Maria yet. It leads me to believe that the carriage represents the new beginning he beleives will have with Mary if he finds her. This time she will not be sick and they can finnaly be together the way he wanted her. But instead he finds a snake, Maria...

Post by **Axel_98** » 25 Aug 2009

I always thought it was about adopting Laura

But yall r correct nice

Post by **Sionnan** » 25 Aug 2009

alone in the town wrote:The swimming pool is empty, resembling the empty life of a man who has lost his wife, his happiness, and a good portion of his sanity. The carriage symbolizes the hope he feels, the hope that drives him to follow the letter into town. This item of hope is guarded by a group of monsters, symbolizing the dangers he must face before he reaches his goal. Upon reaching the carriage, he finds a coin inside, adorned with a snake, which perhaps indicates that James will find what he seeks, only to be met by a dangerous secret (Room 312).

If that's not enough overanalysis, I have another: The carriage symbolizes Maria: A carriage is designed for a baby: New life, new start, a birth (from a wish, hint), but it contains a snake, which in the Bible carries loads of metaphorical weight. It is a serpent who deceives Eve to eat of the Tree of Knowledge, leading her to learn of unpleasant things and be ejected from Heaven (possibly the shattering of delusion? A reference to Silent Heaven?)

Hell, you can take this to be a double-strength indicator of the Leave ending: Not only will eating of the Tree of Knowledge lead one out of (Silent) Heaven, but the pool is conspicuously empty. On top of that, the reference to Maria being the Snake, and the connotations that Rebirth is not desirable (the symbol of birth hiding the snake/Maria (the snake) being reborn repeatedly)--

The whole god damn thing is a huge-ass neon sign that says LEAVE ENDING.

Good night, everybody.

....

DDDD:

____

On my part... I really don't think the baby carriage is something that can be interpreted. I could hazard a guess and say that because the coin (which belongs to a certain family in the apts) was in a baby carriage, perhaps they had a child. Anyway, I'd say it's mostly another incident of the uncanny theory, where you take something normal (a baby carriage, people ina pool), and change it into something abnormal (monsters in an empty pool, the baby carriage in an inappropriate place.) Something designed to add unease.

Post by **Burning Man** » 25 Aug 2009

I think the carriage is simply a homage to Rosemary's Baby. What do I know?

Post by **The Adversary** » 25 Aug 2009

The answer?

Rosemary's Baby is about a woman used to mother the devil. The devil, as alluded to by Ryan, is represented by a snake in Genesis. The snake coin is in the baby carriage. The devil is the baby in the carriage.

Post by **cautsu** » 25 Aug 2009

Could it maybe just be that there's no significance behind the carriage AT ALL, and that the creators just decided to randomly place it there with a snake coin and some monsters? I mean, not to sound like a dick or anything, but not every single little thing is going to have some significance. Then again, maybe it does play some roll within the game. I duuuuuuno. I guess someone just has to be a little sceptical about these things. :>

Post by **Returbuliz** » 25 Aug 2009

Great theory, Alone in the town & MMY.
I'd go with Rosemary's baby as well.
Maria could also be symbolizing Lilith imo, who in some depictions appears as Adam's first wife. Most of her depictions show her with a 'snake' around her waist. An as you know in some eastern cultures, two snakes (posed like an inverted 8.) symbolize 'infinity'. Lilith is derived from the hebrew word "Layl" which means night & nucturnal (Heaven's night?).
So I'm gonna relate this theory to the "Maria" ending, in which

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James is supposed to repeat all the expereince as if nothing has ever happened, since Maria starts coughing like Mary. Therefore in this particular ending James has learned nothing & has to repeat the events till 'eternity'.

The carriage & the snake represent a "rebirth" (rebirth of Mary through Maria) which is in fact a deception (Lilith & the snakes around her) to make James go the wrong way, IMO. (ie. exiled from Heaven)

Post by **Lon** » 25 Aug 2009

Pretty good theories in this thread.

Concerning the Snake coin being Maria:
An Oroborus, which is a snake eating itâ€™s own tail, is a representation of the cycles of mankind destroying themselves over and over again -and relating on what Returbuliz stated:

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A lot conclude that if James chooses Maria, which has been implied as the snake here, then itâ€™s James presumably continuing the cycle of the situation he went through with Mary all over again when Maria â€œcoughsâ€œ.

He is still choosing a life that is empty, still clinging to it, only to be deceived and inevitably realize his own self destruction all over again.

Post by **Axel_98** » 25 Aug 2009

^^^ that sounds pretty good I like that one.

Post by **adjasin** » 28 Aug 2009

I think that Alone in the town conclusion is a good idea, the pool is james refliection, etc, really neat

Post by **regurgitron2000** » 01 Sep 2009

MMY wrote:The answer?

Rosemary's Baby is about a woman used to mother the devil. The devil, as alluded to by Ryan, is represented by a snake in Genesis. The snake coin is in the baby carriage. The devil is the baby in the carriage.

That's a great connection. :]

Post by **Returbuliz** » 06 Sep 2009

>>Concerning my theory about the snake coin & Lilith, yesterday my friend gave me an idea, as he is playing SH2 on his 2nd playthrough:
He's playing on Normal riddle level, & told me that the snake coin in the "5 coin slots" puzzle was symbolized by the phrase "Seducer of she". As the actual normal level puzzle text states: "At one end sits the Seducer of she." or something like that.
The suducer being written in capitals, gave me the impression that it was talking about the same Lilith (depicted as the snake) who seduced Eve into eating the apple as some sources suggest.