Replaying the game and theories [Spoilers]

[Martee]

I've just recently started playing the game again due to not being very impressed by the footage of Downpour. So I figured I'd give Homecoming another go, and I must say this game is AWESOME. I suggest some of you guys play it again in the build up to Downpour.

Further more, I couldn't see any posts regarding this as people are always talking about Alex this and Alex that.
Something I noticed is that I believe Alex IS Josh and Josh is Alex (Split personality). Alex isn't in any of the family photos because HE IS IN THEM! He's just Josh at that moment of time.
Also Josh's dad doesn't like Alex.... because Alex is Josh's crazy side?

Also Josh drowning in my opinion never happened. It was Alex's way of explaining how Josh disappeared (IE, how Alex took over Josh's mind), hence why he's in the mental hospital.

I also believe that most of the people that Alex/Josh sees in the game aren't real. They're just memories of the people he knew as a child. Hence why Travis's truck is abandoned at the back of his house. This also explains why not all the graves in the cemetary have names, because he didn't know any names to put on them.

Also there's symbology all over the game about split personalities. Schism with the split head. Siam with the two people tied together. PH constantly cutting people in half. Also the cutting the weird vagina door things in half to progress. There's also the stone tablet thing in the cemetary that mentions something about a girl who is two halves of the same that are now forever apart. Etc etc.

There are also some more vague examples of this Alex mentions how Josh got a slide bought for him but his parents never bought him anything. How they both had to put their toys away in a toybox and both hid comics in the sofa (even though Alex was apparently considerably older). Alex sharing a bunk bed and appearing to give Josh a flashlight when he was scared. Alex is Josh's defence mechanism when he is afraid.
There is also the tape you find in the house where Josh's dad is nice to Josh until Alex speaks and then the Dad gets mad etc.

The final boss is called Amnion and as my girlfriend (who is a midwife) has explained to me is the Inner membrane of the amniotic sac, there is also the outer membrane called the chorion (which makes no appearance in the game). For one, why have one without the other? The one that's missing being the outer membrane, therefore the one that's left is the internal one. Metaphorical for the loss of the outer (real) personality of Josh and only leaving behind the inner personality of Alex.
Also when you kill the boss Josh comes out of the stomach which I think could be a metaphor for Josh coming out of the 'Inner self' and the protection of the mothers womb (IE his protective place deep within his brain where Alex takes over his body) but unfortunately for Alex/Josh it's too late to bring Josh back from the protective place within and he has well and truly died leaving behind only Alex's personality, thus removing the split personality, which in a way is a good ending.

There are also pregnant nurses which I believe symbolise Alex/Josh's need for a mother-figure, since when Alex/Josh was admitted to the mental hospital he will have still been young.

I think the mother acts strange because she simply wanted to love her child no matter who was in control, however the father Adam wanted to 'kill' Alex to get his real son, Josh back, hence why he believed his father was trying to 'sacrifice' him. Instead of this working Alex gained full control of Josh's body as Josh's defence mechanism went into overdrive, hence why Alex believes he killed Josh.

(This idea needs some more investigation as I get further through the game and is just a rough idea that I'm pondering over.)
I've also begin to wonder if Alex killed the children in the game and that is why his father doesn't like him and why he's in a mental hospital. When you find the picture of the Spider attacking the army men it has something written on the bottom which says 'Someone wouldn't let me squash the spider'. I believe that someone that is scribbled out was Josh who didn't want Alex to kill anything but Alex wanted to.
This could also explain why Adam acts strange because maybe he is covering up for Alex by burying the children that Alex has killed in their garden as one of the drawings that you find depicts.

I don't know if anyone else has mentioned these things before but I'd like to hear some peoples opinions on this. I also apologise for my really bad writing I didn't really know where to start with this post and was just trying to throw down as much stuff as I could before I forgot it. There's most probably more I can comment on when I get further through the game but at the moment this is all I can think of.

[SilentWren]

That's quite interesting, dear.

I like it well enough, but isn't it a bit odd that they bothered throwing all that stuff about the cult and the people disappearing in there?

You've obviously put a lot of thought into this, so I'm just going to leave it at that.

[Aerith Gainsborough]

Your theory could make a lot of sense, actually. That could explain the Hospital ending. Wheeler telling Alex to basically come back to the present, which could mean to stop living in a different state of mind and come back to the real state of mind. However, why would one who is suffering from a psychological issue be considered guilty? Alex was going through a guilt trip through SH:H, so why would someone who doesn't have control over what goes on in their mind be punished?

[Martee]

That's quite interesting, dear.

I like it well enough, but isn't it a bit odd that they bothered throwing all that stuff about the cult and the people disappearing in there?

You've obviously put a lot of thought into this, so I'm just going to leave it at that.

The cult? How do we know the cult isn't symbolic of the people coming to take Josh/Alex away to the mental hospital?

Also people disappearing could easily be to do with the simple fact that Alex/Josh no longer remembers the people, along the same lines as to why the graves have no names on them.

Also was there any need for the patronising tone? but if you're going to leave it at that feel free to let someone post who wants to actually discuss it.

Your theory could make a lot of sense, actually. That could explain the Hospital ending. Wheeler telling Alex to basically come back to the present, which could mean to stop living in a different state of mind and come back to the real state of mind. However, why would one who is suffering from a psychological issue be considered guilty? Alex was going through a guilt trip through SH:H, so why would someone who doesn't have control over what goes on in their mind be punished?

Well Alex is obviously aware of Josh, and I'm thinking that like I said, he believes he killed Josh in his deluded way, but all he actually did was take over Josh's body with his personality and repressed Josh, Homecoming in that respect is essentially Alex's journey to try and bring Josh back from within himself, but as we find out at the end, it is too late and he must carry on living as Alex.

[Martee]

Double post sorry.

[Aerith Gainsborough]

I think it's very possible, I really like this theory of yours. It's a very nice twist, and makes the game appear much more interesting.

[SilentWren]

Kitty's got claws. Ok, I'm game this time:

You're trying to say that it was more like SM & the fourth game, right? Much more of an internal struggle? Then I guess Alex just remembered reading something about the cult being exposed and that got all meshed up with his memories?

[Martee]

It is more than plausible that, (bearing in mind this theory, plus lots of references in the game mean that he is mentally ill), Alex believed a cult was after him, especially with all that went on in near by Silent Hill, I'm pretty sure the cult from Silent Hill would have been big news around there.

Please stop with trying to provoke an argument, your post didn't need the starting sentence. There's no need to be disrespectful.

[SilentWren]

I was being respectful of you standing your ground. Peace, bro.

That's the problem with word only communication. There's no way to portray emotion without using a paragraph's worth of smilies.

[Soulless-Shadow]

Just in case I'll mention straight away that there are unmarked spoilers for Homecoming further in my post. I don't think I need to mark them seeing as the thread title says "spoilers", but knowing my luck if I don't someone who hasn't played Homecoming will disregard the "Spoiler", will come in, read my post, then have a tantrum that I ruined the game for them.
Also, there are tagged spoilers for SH2, 0rigins, and Shattered Memories.

Interesting theory, but if the game were all in Alex's mind and was all about hunting down his wayward split personality, then surely there would be some big reveal at the end of the game to prove it. In all the other games things have been exposed for the player and protagonist near the end. While each game still leaves some things up for debate, the state of the protagonists metal health is always cleared up. If the events of Homecoming were all in Alex's head, then it's the only game in the series that doesn't completely clear up the protagonists state of mind. For example:

*Silent Hill 2 Spoilers*

PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:

We find out near the end of the game that the letter and time of Mary's death was all a part of James' delusion. James learns the truth about what really happened, and we find out that James was just a little bit nutty.

*Silent Hill 0rigins Spoilers*

PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:

Travis finds out near the end what really happened to his parents, which he had been suppressing for possibly most of his adult life.

*Silent Hill: Shattered Memories Spoilers*

PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:

At the end it's revealed that the entire game, and even the existence of the protagonist, is all in Cheryl's head. We're left with no doubt about Cheryl's mental well-being.

If Homecoming were all in Alex's head, or just about a split personality, then it would be breaking the trend of the other games by leaving it so ambiguous. Now, if the only metal problems Alex had are simply related to his brother's death (and going to war and blah, blah, blah), then that fits in well with the way the other games work, as the truth is revealed to us/him.

I would like to touch upon some specific things in Martee's first post, but unfortunately I don't have time. Hopefully later.

[Martee]

I was being respectful of you standing your ground. Peace, bro.

That's the problem with word only communication. There's no way to portray emotion without using a paragraph's worth of smilies.

After this post your previous posts read in a completely different light. I think we should develop some new language purely made up of smilies.

Before I get off track I'll add some more things that I've been thinking about that link in with the theory here:

Judge Holloway is seen in a picture with Josh/Alex' mother, I believe this picture was probably taken around the time that Josh/Alex was going to be taken away to the hospital, and through this and the news he had probably heard about the cult from Silent Hill and Judge Holloways ties to her escape from the cult infested Silent Hill he believed her to be the leader of some cult that was 'out to get him'. While in reality she was just doing her job as the judge in the town and sectioning Josh/Alex.
This also ties in with the doctor being part of it, as Josh/Alex would have had to visit the doctor at some point to have his psyche analysed. Furthermore along the lines of psyche analysis I believe the child's drawings that you find around the town were drawn by Alex's personality within Josh and are a clear indicator of mental illness (dead bodies all over the place ).

Also at the start of the game Josh asks Alex to find his robbie doll, Alex then finds the doll protruding from a 'vagina' like hole in a mirror, which I think is telling Alex to look at himself and the 'protective' nature of a mothers womb that is protecting Josh within him. Which links to all the other mother/child references in the game.
Then when you try to give Josh the doll he refuses it and runs away. I believe this is to do with the photograph you find of the Robbie doll that says something like 'the doll keeps away the boogeyman'. If all of the photographs and drawings in the game are actually made by the Alex personality and not Josh's, then this would mean that Alex actually believes he needs to keep the doll in order for PH not to be able to harm him. Which is why I believe you never fight PH in the game.

In reply to Soulless-Shadow I believe the mental hospital ending is a clear decider for me, I think they wanted to be subtle with the game and let you decide what happened. In the hospital ending wheeler (ie one of the doctors) tells him he's not going anywhere until he accepts reality, in response to Alex waking up and saying 'I didnt go anywhere? Wheres Josh?'

Also in the 'Drowning ending' when we are meant to believe that Adam is drowning Alex, if you listen you can hear what sounds like Josh cry 'Noooo!' from under the water. The father believed that by drowning the boy he would be able to make Alex leave his son Josh alone, but his plan backfires and he is left with Alex instead.

Personally I think there is a big reveal, however it's just a lot more subtle than the games you listed and we have to remember that each game has been by a different developer. Also when Elle asks Josh/Alex what he saw at the end of the game in the good ending he simply says 'What I needed to' which again is a very subtle way of letting the player decide.

[Soulless-Shadow]

In reply to Soulless-Shadow I believe the mental hospital ending is a clear decider for me, I think they wanted to be subtle with the game and let you decide what happened. In the hospital ending wheeler (ie one of the doctors) tells him he's not going anywhere until he accepts reality, in response to Alex waking up and saying 'I didnt go anywhere? Wheres Josh?'

I don't deny that the hospital ending shows that everything was in Alex's head, however, if Alex/Josh were different personalities, then that would still be revealed. The other games, regardless of whether or not the protagonists accept the truth, still reveal what's really going on (ie; whether they're nuts or not). In Homecoming Alex's problems are still revealed, even for the hospital ending. If Josh were a different aspect of Alex's personality, then it would be revealed, regardless of whether or not Alex is still in the nut house.

Something I noticed is that I believe Alex IS Josh and Josh is Alex (Split personality). Alex isn't in any of the family photos because HE IS IN THEM! He's just Josh at that moment of time.

Again there's nothing in the game to suggest that they are the same person. If anything, Alex not being in the photos shows his parents distancing themselves from Alex in order to make the sacrifice easier on themselves.

Also Josh's dad doesn't like Alex.... because Alex is Josh's crazy side?

Or he's distancing himself from Alex to make it easier to sacrifice him.

Also Josh drowning in my opinion never happened. It was Alex's way of explaining how Josh disappeared (IE, how Alex took over Josh's mind), hence why he's in the mental hospital.

If this were true, then wouldn't the drowning be revealed a lot sooner? If Alex were trying to explain to himself how his other personality disappeared, then shouldn't we know from the start that Josh drowned, thus leaving the big reveal at the end the fact that Josh never really existed? (or Alex or whoever is supposedly the other personality)

I also believe that most of the people that Alex/Josh sees in the game aren't real. They're just memories of the people he knew as a child. Hence why Travis's truck is abandoned at the back of his house. This also explains why not all the graves in the cemetary have names, because he didn't know any names to put on them.

It's been a long time since I've played, but I don't think Alex knew Curtis beforehand, and I don't think he had the chance to meet Wheeler either. If the people are memories, then how can he "remember" people he's never met?

Also there's symbology all over the game about split personalities. Schism with the split head. Siam with the two people tied together. PH constantly cutting people in half. Also the cutting the weird vagina door things in half to progress. There's also the stone tablet thing in the cemetary that mentions something about a girl who is two halves of the same that are now forever apart. Etc etc.

Here's a thread about the monster symbolism. The Schisms do seem to represent a split of some kind, but that would more likely be symbolic of the people of Shepard's Glen splitting from the Order, or possibly (like someone mentions in that thread) the split in Alex's mind between the real him and the solider aspect/back-story he's created.

Alex sharing a bunk bed and appearing to give Josh a flashlight when he was scared. Alex is Josh's defence mechanism when he is afraid.

Or he was just being a good older brother looking out for his scared younger brother.

There is also the tape you find in the house where Josh's dad is nice to Josh until Alex speaks and then the Dad gets mad etc.

You mean this one:
Josh: Rar, rar, rar, rar...
(He makes other weird noises.)
Mr. Shepherd: Josh! Josh...JOSH! What are you doing.
Alex: Relax, dad, we're just making a radio show.
Mr. Shepherd: Alex, go downstairs.
Alex: Why?
Mr. Shepherd: Just do it!
Alex: Fine.
(Sound of door slamming.)
Josh: Am I in trouble?
Mr. Shepherd: No, of course not.
Josh: Why are you yelling?
Mr. Shepherd: I'm not yelling at you. Listen to me, Josh. Don't you think this is a little too silly for you? Do you want to end up like Alex? Playing all this make-believe?
Josh: I don't know.
Mr. Shepherd: Alright, from now on, just let Alex play with his own friends, okay? And if you need a friend, you come talk to me. Got it?
Josh: Yes, sir!
That doesn't really show anything about split personalities, rather a parent telling off a child.

The final boss is called Amnion and as my girlfriend (who is a midwife) has explained to me is the Inner membrane of the amniotic sac, there is also the outer membrane called the chorion (which makes no appearance in the game). For one, why have one without the other? The one that's missing being the outer membrane, therefore the one that's left is the internal one. Metaphorical for the loss of the outer (real) personality of Josh and only leaving behind the inner personality of Alex.

Amnion could tie in with the vagina-esque zippy/teeth doors, as well as the Needlers and pregnant nurses. I guess you could say family. As pointed out in this thread, the theme of the game seems to be "family and duty".

Also when you kill the boss Josh comes out of the stomach which I think could be a metaphor for Josh coming out of the 'Inner self' and the protection of the mothers womb (IE his protective place deep within his brain where Alex takes over his body) but unfortunately for Alex/Josh it's too late to bring Josh back from the protective place within and he has well and truly died leaving behind only Alex's personality, thus removing the split personality, which in a way is a good ending.

Wait, which one do you think is the other personality? If it's Alex, then having him take control isn't a happy ending.

I think the mother acts strange because she simply wanted to love her child no matter who was in control, however the father Adam wanted to 'kill' Alex to get his real son, Josh back, hence why he believed his father was trying to 'sacrifice' him.

Or she's catatonic because one son died, the other is nuts, and they're all going to hell for failing in their duty to their God and town.

I've also begin to wonder if Alex killed the children in the game and that is why his father doesn't like him and why he's in a mental hospital.

That's a bit of a stretch. There's no evidence to even hint to such things, whereas we're told with no room for doubt that it was their parents who sacrificed them.

When you find the picture of the Spider attacking the army men it has something written on the bottom which says 'Someone wouldn't let me squash the spider'. I believe that someone that is scribbled out was Josh who didn't want Alex to kill anything but Alex wanted to.

I've seen someone draw parallels between that photo and the final boss fight; giant spider-like creature towering over a "solider". If anything, it's a hint to the form of the final boss, not a suggestion that Alex is a crazed murder. Besides, I kill spiders all the time, and I'm perfectly child-murder free (I'd much prefer to be spider free, but what can you do? *shrugs*).

This could also explain why Adam acts strange because maybe he is covering up for Alex by burying the children that Alex has killed in their garden as one of the drawings that you find depicts.

If anything that drawing is connected with the others; the telling of a cautionary story about the Boogeyman for the children of Shepard's Glen.
Info on the drawings can be found here.

I'm pretty sure I've left out a few things I wanted to say... >_< Anyway, having said all that, I would love a game that leaves everything so ambiguous, but I don't think that's Homecoming. The Homecoming Quicklinks have some interesting threads if you want some more information.

[Martee]

I don't deny that the hospital ending shows that everything was in Alex's head, however, if Alex/Josh were different personalities, then that would still be revealed. The other games, regardless of whether or not the protagonists accept the truth, still reveal what's really going on (ie; whether they're nuts or not). In Homecoming Alex's problems are still revealed, even for the hospital ending. If Josh were a different aspect of Alex's personality, then it would be revealed, regardless of whether or not Alex is still in the nut house.

So your entire argument for this is that they don’t spell it out for you? And that the other games did so this one must too. What I’ve done is pointed out a few things that quite clearly can be seen to show there is more going on than meets the eye.
Furthermore, you’re more inclined to believe that an entire town of crazy people killed loads of kids to appease an unnamed God instead of one man, whom you already said is crazy... is crazy.

Again there's nothing in the game to suggest that they are the same person. If anything, Alex not being in the photos shows his parents distancing themselves from Alex in order to make the sacrifice easier on themselves.

There is nothing to suggest it apart from the multiple things I have already pointed out and I have a few more on the way. Again, you would rather believe that an entire town is crazy than one person.

Or he's distancing himself from Alex to make it easier to sacrifice him.

Again, you would rather believe an entire town... .blah blah blah.

If this were true, then wouldn't the drowning be revealed a lot sooner? If Alex were trying to explain to himself how his other personality disappeared, then shouldn't we know from the start that Josh drowned, thus leaving the big reveal at the end the fact that Josh never really existed? (or Alex or whoever is supposedly the other personality)

Since you like to compare to previous games, we didn’t know that James killed Mary at the start. Further more Homecoming hints right from the start about the drowning. Also Josh did exist, but so did Alex within him, Alex being the protector of Josh who wanted to be like his soldier father. The father who didn’t want his son being “caught up in all that occult rubbish” (which Alex mentions in the game), this would also explain why the father didn’t want his son to come into his hunting room because he didn’t want his son to turn out like him.

It's been a long time since I've played, but I don't think Alex knew Curtis beforehand, and I don't think he had the chance to meet Wheeler either. If the people are memories, then how can he "remember" people he's never met?

Adam is friends with Curtis, I would find it hard to believe that Adams son wouldn’t have known one of his friends. Further more Wheeler is simply a faceless police man who takes on the image and voice of one of the doctors from the hospital that Josh/Alex is staying in, as the hospital ending shows.

Here's a thread about the monster symbolism. The Schisms do seem to represent a split of some kind, but that would more likely be symbolic of the people of Shepard's Glen splitting from the Order, or possibly (like someone mentions in that thread) the split in Alex's mind between the real him and the solider aspect/back-story he's created.

You’re trying to disprove my theory by showing me another theory? Both of which are based on the game with no solid proof of either? Also I’ll say it again, you would rather believe an entire town is crazy instead of one person. Plus it’s split personality, that’s even the name of the achievement, it’s not split personalities or split town.

Or he was just being a good older brother looking out for his scared younger brother.

Which still makes sense if Alex was just a manifested brother.

You mean this one:
Josh: Rar, rar, rar, rar...
(He makes other weird noises.)
Mr. Shepherd: Josh! Josh...JOSH! What are you doing.
Alex: Relax, dad, we're just making a radio show.
Mr. Shepherd: Alex, go downstairs.
Alex: Why?
Mr. Shepherd: Just do it!
Alex: Fine.
(Sound of door slamming.)
Josh: Am I in trouble?
Mr. Shepherd: No, of course not.
Josh: Why are you yelling?
Mr. Shepherd: I'm not yelling at you. Listen to me, Josh. Don't you think this is a little too silly for you? Do you want to end up like Alex? Playing all this make-believe?
Josh: I don't know.
Mr. Shepherd: Alright, from now on, just let Alex play with his own friends, okay? And if you need a friend, you come talk to me. Got it?
Josh: Yes, sir!
That doesn't really show anything about split personalities, rather a parent telling off a child.

If you actually open your mind to my theory and read that again you will see that it can still quite easily be seen as one person with multiple personalities. You never hear the two people speak at the same time, and Josh seems confused as to why his father is mad... Maybe because when Alex took over his body for that small time Josh couldn’t see his father actually get mad?

Amnion could tie in with the vagina-esque zippy/teeth doors, as well as the Needlers and pregnant nurses. I guess you could say family. As pointed out in this thread, the theme of the game seems to be "family and duty".

You’re trying to disprove my theory with another theory again.

Wait, which one do you think is the other personality? If it's Alex, then having him take control isn't a happy ending.

You missed the part where I said ‘in a way is a good ending’. It’s not him taking control, he had already done that, he just came to terms with it , hence why he tells Elle that he saw what he needed to see. Also James apparently gets to leave Silent Hill with an innocent young girl after murdering his wife.... happy ending?

Or she's catatonic because one son died, the other is nuts, and they're all going to hell for failing in their duty to their God and town.

Theory versus theory, this thread is about the theory I have put forwards not another theory with just as much speculation. Again, you go with the crazy town instead of the crazy one man.

That's a bit of a stretch. There's no evidence to even hint to such things, whereas we're told with no room for doubt that it was their parents who sacrificed them.

Hence why I said I was beginning to wonder and that I was going to look into it further. Also if a boy drawing a picture of his back garden with lots of dead bodies underneath it doesn’t show that something is going on I don’t know what does. Unless you’re suggesting that Josh is psychic?

I've seen someone draw parallels between that photo and the final boss fight; giant spider-like creature towering over a "solider". If anything, it's a hint to the form of the final boss, not a suggestion that Alex is a crazed murder. Besides, I kill spiders all the time, and I'm perfectly child-murder free (I'd much prefer to be spider free, but what can you do? *shrugs*).

Theory versus theory again, also you might kill spiders all the time but do you draw dead bodies and know about a monster from silent hill who will kill you? You’re comparing yourself a relatively sane person to someone who in my theory is insane. Also if you’re saying that picture ties into the last boss, why was anyone telling Alex/Josh not to kill the last boss?

If anything that drawing is connected with the others; the telling of a cautionary story about the Boogeyman for the children of Shepard's Glen.

So now we’re happy with a crazy town with one sane person who is shown to be insane, but we’re not allowed to have a monster on the loose that is a metaphor for the killer inside Alex.

Info on the drawings can be found here.

I'll get onto the drawings and pictures more in the future.

Also like I said I have a lot of other tie ins to Josh and Alex being one and the same that I have yet to post, but this post has gone on too long so I'll leave it for now.
Thanks for the reply but can we please keep this thread about this theory, there's no point in comparing theories, when we have no real proof about either/any.

[Soulless-Shadow]

So your entire argument for this is that they don’t spell it out for you? And that the other games did so this one must too. What I’ve done is pointed out a few things that quite clearly can be seen to show there is more going on than meets the eye.

You missed my point. It's not about having something "spelled out" to anyone. All the games, not just the ones I used as examples, explain some of what's going on by the end. Harry, James, Heather, Henry, Travis, and even Alex find what it is they're looking for, or at least the truth behind this, that, or whatever. Why would the narrative be changed for one single game? Each one might be different, but they're also the same. They flow the same. Generally games, books, movies, and whatnot from the same developer/author/director/genre flow the same way. Hence my using previous games as examples. Until another SH game pops up that completely changes that, my point still stands (it's looking very unlikely that something so different will be tried, seeing as every develop seems to want to play it safe).

Furthermore, you’re more inclined to believe that an entire town of crazy people killed loads of kids to appease an unnamed God instead of one man, whom you already said is crazy... is crazy.

I don't recall saying anyone other than Alex was crazy. The converts we meet did what they did because they honestly thought they were screwed and going to Hell. Besides, it wouldn't be the first time in history humanity has done heinous things in the name of religion.

There is nothing to suggest it apart from the multiple things I have already pointed out and I have a few more on the way. Again, you would rather believe that an entire town is crazy than one person.

The "multiple things" you have "already pointed out" are based on overlooking a lot of other things that are in-game and in extra material. There is nothing the game itself, or in any of the extra material I have seen, to suggest, let alone hint, that Alex or Josh or whomever has split personality.

Again, you would rather believe an entire town... .blah blah blah.

Again you would rather overlook in-game and extra material...blah, blah, blah...

PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:

Since you like to compare to previous games, we didn’t know that James killed Mary at the start.

I suggest you use spoiler tags for non Homecoming related spoilers, seeing as no-one is expecting spoilers for other games. I realise SH2 has been out for a while, but there still might be people who haven't played it yet.
Anyway:
*Silent Hill 2 Spoilers*

PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:

When, how and by whose hand Mary died is a major part of James' mental well-being...

...just like Josh's death is a major part of Alex's well-being. After all, it was Josh's death that triggered Alex's breakdown. Either way, we're not supposed to know that Josh is actually dead from the get go. Now, if we weren't to know Josh was a different aspect of the same personality, then that would be revealed near the end rather than Josh's fate.

Further more Homecoming hints right from the start about the drowning.

*Silent Hill 2 Spoilers*

PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:

Mary's fate was hinted at long before we found out the truth. Just about everything in SH2 was hinting towards either Mary's fate or James' guilt.

Besides, of course there would be hints to Josh's death. The otherworld is influenced by thought/emotions. Alex saw/was responsible for Josh's death, so naturally there would be things to reflect that.

Also Josh did exist, but so did Alex within him, Alex being the protector of Josh who wanted to be like his soldier father. The father who didn’t want his son being “caught up in all that occult rubbish” (which Alex mentions in the game), this would also explain why the father didn’t want his son to come into his hunting room because he didn’t want his son to turn out like him.

And yet Josh was allowed in Adam's hunting room...

Adam is friends with Curtis, I would find it hard to believe that Adams son wouldn’t have known one of his friends. Further more Wheeler is simply a faceless police man who takes on the image and voice of one of the doctors from the hospital that Josh/Alex is staying in, as the hospital ending shows.

Do you know all your father's friends? I don't know all my mother's friends. To claim Alex knows Curtis simply because his father knew him is a bit of a stretch. As for Wheeler and the doctor in the hospital ending, it's been a while since I've played, so I don't recall if it is indeed Wheeler/his voice actor or what. In relation to that ending, Wheeler could very well be based on the doctor. Hell, that ending could be in Alex's head too, so Dr. Wheeler could be based on anyone or no-one. I'm not arguing that the game (tied in with that ending) isn't all in Alex's head. I'm arguing that Josh and Alex are separate people.

You’re trying to disprove my theory by showing me another theory? Both of which are based on the game with no solid proof of either? Also I’ll say it again, you would rather believe an entire town is crazy instead of one person. Plus it’s split personality, that’s even the name of the achievement, it’s not split personalities or split town.

Again you're missing the point of my post. I added that link because I thought you'd find it interesting and to give you something else to consider. My mistake. I'll refrain from being so considerate in the future.

Or he was just being a good older brother looking out for his scared younger brother.

Which still makes sense if Alex was just a manifested brother.

How does it make more sense for it to be Alex looking out for a "manifested brother" than it does for him to be looking out for a real brother?

If you actually open your mind to my theory and read that again you will see that it can still quite easily be seen as one person with multiple personalities. You never hear the two people speak at the same time, and Josh seems confused as to why his father is mad... Maybe because when Alex took over his body for that small time Josh couldn’t see his father actually get mad?

I did try reading that exchange as though there were different personalities, but it didn't fit in with what was presented. But tell me, if that were made for spilt personalities in mind, which personality got up and slammed the door? Or was that unrelated background noise from mother dearest?

You’re trying to disprove my theory with another theory again.

Again I apologise for my thoughtlessness at trying to give you some more information and something to think about. I'll try not to do that again.

You missed the part where I said ‘in a way is a good ending’. It’s not him taking control, he had already done that, he just came to terms with it , hence why he tells Elle that he saw what he needed to see.

Yes, he saw the truth of what he did, who he was, and who he wasn't. That didn't include split personality though.

PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:

Also James apparently gets to leave Silent Hill with an innocent young girl after murdering his wife.... happy ending?

*Silent Hill 2 Spoilers*

PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:

Well, considering the other alternatives was suicide, living in delusion, possibly reviving a zombie*, or having everything orchestrated by a dog, I think it is the best ending. Especially when you consider that Mary forgave him (well, she forgives him most of the time anyway), Laura forgave him, and James finally accepts and comes to terms with what he did.

*Yes, I'll admit that is some conjecture on my part. Too many horror movies to think to think it could actually end happily.

Theory versus theory, this thread is about the theory I have put forwards not another theory with just as much speculation. Again, you go with the crazy town instead of the crazy one man.

You under-estimate how far the devoted are willing to go for their beliefs.

Hence why I said I was beginning to wonder and that I was going to look into it further. Also if a boy drawing a picture of his back garden with lots of dead bodies underneath it doesn’t show that something is going on I don’t know what does. Unless you’re suggesting that Josh is psychic?

So, how exactly do you know it was Josh who drew all those pictures? I mean the real Josh? We only see the Josh drawing in the dream at the start. Either way, it doesn't matter. They would probably be told cautionary stories about their cult as kids, so assuming those drawings were created by Alex's subconscious/Josh when he wasn't floating in the river and not that of the collective town's subconscious, it doesn't really say he's crazy enough to murder a bunch of kids and bury them in their backyard.

Theory versus theory again, also you might kill spiders all the time but do you draw dead bodies and know about a monster from silent hill who will kill you? You’re comparing yourself a relatively sane person to someone who in my theory is insane.

So, the idea that killing spiders = crazed child killer makes more sense than ZOMG GIANT SPIDER STANDING OVER LITTLE SOLIDER MAN = something-or-other influence on last boss? Usually serial killers start by torturing animals, then move on to people. So, if it was someone's pet Josh stopped him from killing, then you'd have a point.

Also if you’re saying that picture ties into the last boss, why was anyone telling Alex/Josh not to kill the last boss?

I love it when people take what I have said out of context in an effort to prove me wrong. To answer you, no, Josh isn't telling Alex to not kill the last boss because Alex wasn't allowed to kill the spider. Ever thought that that picture made a major imprint of Alex's mind, hence the influence on the final boss? Not only that, but each boss manifestation reflects not only the childrens hobbies, but their form of sacrifice (or in Josh's case, plain old form of death).
-Joey loved trees/was buried alive, hence big arse ugly tree monster coming out the the ground.
-Scarlet loved dolls/was dismembered, hence big arse ugly doll monster will freaky limbs.
-Nora loved Alice in Wonderland/was strangled, hence big arse ugly caterpillar like monster with hands around its throat/mouth/something.
-Josh loved bugs/was drowned (accidental), hence big arse ugly bloated* spider thing.

*people who have drowned apparently have a habit of looking all bloated once pulled out of the water.

So now we’re happy with a crazy town with one sane person who is shown to be insane, but we’re not allowed to have a monster on the loose that is a metaphor for the killer inside Alex.

I'll refrain from linking you to the page that discusses the Boogeyman's purpose as you'll just refute that saying it's theory against theory. It really is an interesting read though. Also, I don't recall seeing anything in game that would suggest the Boogeyman is anything to do with Alex. From what we see in game, he's a punisher, not unlike Pyramid Head. However, for the most part he doesn't bother with Alex, so it doesn't appear as though he's punishing Alex...I wonder who he could be punishing...?

Thanks for the reply but can we please keep this thread about this theory, there's no point in comparing theories, when we have no real proof about either/any.

*sigh* Try to be nice and give someone some information and they shit in your face (figuratively speaking, of course. Also, sorry for such an unpleasant image). Those theories were linked because I felt they were relevant to your points and could give you some extra information to think about. As I said, I won't do that any more. It was naive of me to think it would be appreciated or contribute to the conversation.

Your theory is interesting, but there's nothing in-game or in any extra material to suggest that Alex and Josh are different aspects of the same person, whereas there is just so much stuff to tell us that Josh and Alex are brothers, and blah, blah, blah.

[Martee]

Theory versus theory talk is pointless, you're not willing to even give my idea a chance because you already have a set way of looking at the game, which is fine, this thread is not for you.
I don't need to read threads about what other people think the monsters mean when I'm explaining what I think they mean.
I'm not trying to tie up everyone elses loose ends, you either agree with me or you don't, but you cannot say I am wrong because someone else, whether that is you or your friend simply think their theory is better.
Read what I have said, remove the theories already in your head and you might see what I'm trying to say.
I believed most of the theories that were being thrown around these forums at one point but the entire game just seemed like such a mess and to be honest, felt like the imaginings of a mad man, and when I began to think that maybe indeed, they were, it all seemed to fall into place.
You also can't cling onto one idea that I proposed that I was contemplating as though my entire argument is based around it, that being the idea of Alex killing the kids. That was just another idea that I was throwing out there with no real baring on the rest of my ideas.
I appreciate that you're trying to give me more 'information' but the fact is the information you are trying to give me is stuff I have already read, I'm trying to look at it from a different perspective, one, which to me, makes a lot more sense than trying to argue that there are loads of people killing people for an unnamed religion in unspeakable ways, even after they had fled from a town to escape from another cult doing the same thing, instead of simply proposing that maybe that's a delusion. You also cannot claim that just because religion in real life kills people means that Alex cannot be insane. Guess what, a lot of people who have psychosis have religious delusions, and religion and psychosis can exist with or without the other.
After all, if they really wanted Alex dead why didn't Curtis or Holloway just kill him on first sight? They tried to help Alex out when he first met them, Holloway was reasonably pleasant with Alex and told him that he should go see Elle, Curtis even gave Alex a gun and told Alex to look around if he wanted to find out the truth (including telling him about the stopped time). Which unless Alex somehow has some magical way of controlling the time within the town for himself and everyone within it, the most logical explanation is simply that the town isn't real, and it's stuck at that time, because it's in his mind, his mind that coincidentally is stuck in the room 2:06.

So take it or leave it, you're arguing that nothing tells you that he's crazy when I'm arguing that lots of things tell me he is, that's subjective, so the argument can go no where.

P.S. the noise on the tape that you think is a door slamming is a toy being thrown on the floor.

[AuraTwilight]

Something I noticed is that I believe Alex IS Josh and Josh is Alex (Split personality). Alex isn't in any of the family photos because HE IS IN THEM! He's just Josh at that moment of time.
Also Josh's dad doesn't like Alex.... because Alex is Josh's crazy side?

That's stupid. You might as well say the whole game never happened. Alex just made up this entire fantasy so he could be all emo over nothing, making all the symbolism, meaning, deepness, and intellectual depth the game did have mean nothing.

If Josh and Alex are the same person, why did they stop taking pictures of them after he was nine, or whatever? Why did he create this alternate personality in the first place? It certainly wasn't anything like abuse; Josh was practically spoiled by his parents. Why does Josh run away from Alex, if Alex never harmed Josh? Why did he make up this whole plot about killing Josh and needing to be sacrificed by a cult and all this nonsense? Insane people aren't very good at crafting coherent narratives for their delusions.

You're basically advocating that Josh made up Alex who made up the death/cult plot who them made up the army thing in order to cover up the imaginary murder of an imaginary person. That's dumb as hell.

[Martee]

That's stupid. You might as well say the whole game never happened. Alex just made up this entire fantasy so he could be all emo over nothing, making all the symbolism, meaning, deepness, and intellectual depth the game did have mean nothing.

If you open your mind to my theory you might notice that all of the things you just said above don't apply to what I'm saying.
Also you're essentially saying that people's thoughts don't matter, when I thought Silent Hill was all about the darkness within people. Do we need monsters and rusty hallways to really exist for them to have just as much impact?

If Josh and Alex are the same person, why did they stop taking pictures of them after he was nine, or whatever? Why did he create this alternate personality in the first place? It certainly wasn't anything like abuse; Josh was practically spoiled by his parents. Why does Josh run away from Alex, if Alex never harmed Josh? Why did he make up this whole plot about killing Josh and needing to be sacrificed by a cult and all this nonsense? Insane people aren't very good at crafting coherent narratives for their delusions.

Why did they stop taking pictures of him? Because maybe as my theory suggests he was in a mental hospital?
Create the alternate personality? Why don't you ask my brother who grew up in a perfect home with no abuse of any kind why he's schizophrenic? Maybe insane people don't have a choice about being insane?
When we see Josh in the game he runs away because that Josh is a manifestation, and deep within Alex's mind he thinks he killed Josh.
Again, like I said before, if you think about it, the idea of Alex being insane is a lot more coherent than running around trying to follow the crazy plot of the game, where people suddenly change from being normal to being psycho. The story plays like the paranoid delusions of a crazy person.... no?

You're basically advocating that Josh made up Alex who made up the death/cult plot who them made up the army thing in order to cover up the imaginary murder of an imaginary person. That's dumb as hell.

Insane people don't make up anyone, they're just there, chemical imbalance and all that jazz?
Josh is a real person, just as much as Alex is a real person, the whole point of the theory is that they're split personalities. It's not that hard to understand if you open your mind.
Plus if we assume that Josh/Alex is in the hospital the entire game being administered shock therapy, and taking his Serum that's Kaufmanns handiwork. Isn't Kaufmann tied to white claudia... a hallucinogenic?
Furthermore if you read what you said again and think about my theory with it, you might realise how what you said just sounds like the story of mad man? Which is exactly what I'm saying.

Again, you're arguing that my story is so far fetched by saying that a town of cultists who ran away from an evil cult because they didn't like them, has decided to go on a rampage to appease a God that has no name. Again, it sounds like a story written by a child who has heard things about the cult from SIlent Hill. Even the Halo of the Sun in the game looks like a childs sketch of what he thinks the Halo of the Sun looks like. Or am I just meant to believe that the developers were lazy and didn't want to put any detail onto the spin off cults symbol?

This isn't a discussion about other theories..... please if you're going to post in this thread clear your mind of your previous ideas and really think about this theory. Maybe even play the game again with this in mind. There is no point in discussing a theory if the thread just becomes clogged up with information from other theories. That's like arguing Wave/Particle theory. Until we get more insight nothing will move forward.
So instead of just trying to look all big and clever by bashing it, be postive, think about it and discuss. Otherwise there's no point in even having this forum here.

[SilentWren]

I understand what you're trying to say, it just seems unlikely to me that they would base a Silent Hill game on this concept. I understand the direction you're going-about inner demons and all-but it doesn't necessarily follow the established formula to my ears.

I've got to give you respect for putting this much thought into Homecoming, though. I was so distracted by certain aspects of it that I somewhat ignored it. At any rate, good luck.

[The Adversary]

>you're not willing to even give my idea a chance because you already have a set way of looking at the game<
There's a good reason for this: The theory makes no sense.

[Martee]

>you're not willing to even give my idea a chance because you already have a set way of looking at the game<
There's a good reason for this: The theory makes no sense.

Now I see why you have such a high post count, you don't actually input anything.
I'm glad it makes no sense to you, I wouldn't want to think like you anyway.
I'm gunna get a mod to close this post because no one apparently wants to discuss anything like usual on this pointless forum.