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 Post subject: Leave Ending

My theory for why Leave ending is the true ending is as follows:

[spoiler]Team Silent makes games and its goal is to market them so people enjoy them. Adding various endings increases interest in a game like this the way some game developers create on-line multiplayer worlds. Hence, the real plot might follow one path more closely, in this case Leave ending, and incidentally should be the easiest to reach, while the other endings are more 'out of the way,' so to speak. Basically, I find it unlikely that a gamer would continue examining the knife Angela gave James once they already took a look at it. Also, I find it more unlikely that people would wait till the last minute before healing themselves. Therefore, the likelihood of achieving Leave ending is much higher for most people(and therefore the ending Team Silent most likely expected most people to see). Regarding Maria ending, who hasn't looked over Mary's picture a number of times to either search for clues or just to see the image of the person James is so devastated over? Also, who here hasn't tried to see what would happen if you gave Maria the occasional 'shove' or 'love tap?' I for one didn't, but I did run pretty much everywhere, with or without Maria, and I assume most people would as well. Therefore, Maria ending would be another unlikely ending for most people, in my opinion. Obviously, all the other endings come only after you played the game at least one time, so therefore they would not be Team Silent's intended 'true ending.'

Another word on this concept of a 'true ending.' True, there is no real ending, since this is just a game. I mean, what about those Choose Your Own Adventure stories people read when they were a child? Those didn't have a 'true ending.' However, in the case of Silent Hill, I believe Team Silent stuck to one plot that pretty much evolved into one ending which could be split into three separate endings at the very end at the flick of a switch. Basically, even though what you do throughout the game affects the ending you get, it's not until the very end that the scenario changes appropriately to fit with the specific ending you achieved. In essence, Team Silent made the whole game and at the very end put a fork where people would take different turns depending on previous actions. In conclusion, however, one must rationalize what ending Team Silent would have wanted if they could choose only one. Would they choose an ending where after eight hours of gameplay James just kills himself? Or one where he takes off with this likeness of Mary by the name of Maria? I find it more likely that they would have ended it according to the screenplay in Leave ending, if they had to choose one. This is, after all, the good ending, where it all concludes.[/spoiler] Just my opinion, of course.


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Historical Society Historian
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You don't have to continuously examine Angela's knife in order to get the In Water ending - there are other circumstances that, if done once, ensure a better chance for that ending as well.

So.. you're implication and defense of Leave's veracity is not anything about the storyline, but gameplay that "makes the most sense?" No two gamers are alike, and I've seen endings vary from player to player - Leave was my first ending, yes, but Maria has always been the ending my friend received until she learned other ways to play the game.

Just because you got this ending the first time around doesn't mean that the other endings can't hold their own up against it. If you're going to question the sense and logic behind an ending, look at your beloved Leave: [spoiler]James leaves the town to, presumably, live a life with Laura: yet he has his wife's body in the trunk, and Laura is pretty pissed off at what he did. He'd have to dispose of the body and find a rather tricky way to explain just what happened to her, and placate an eight-year-old who's best friend is dead, and who was pretty steamed at him in the last scene of the game.[/spoiler]

Just because it's the "good" ending, doesn't mean it's the "true" ending.

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 Post subject:

[spoiler]The part about Mary being in the trunk is what allows me to believe that this can be the 'true' ending. The reason for this is that I have not come across any evidence supporting the notion that there is anyone in his trunk. All I was able to glean from the game was that he left after having closure, realizing that he was only delusional and now clear in his mind, heading off to continue his new life.[/spoiler]


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 Post subject:

I think inwater is the true ending because james could not come to terms with the fact he did you know what to mary :(


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 Post subject: Re: Leave Ending

Alex24 wrote:
My theory for why Leave ending is the true ending is as follows:

[spoiler]Team Silent makes games and its goal is to market them so people enjoy them. Adding various endings increases interest in a game like this the way some game developers create on-line multiplayer worlds. Hence, the real plot might follow one path more closely, in this case Leave ending, and incidentally should be the easiest to reach, while the other endings are more 'out of the way,' so to speak. Basically, I find it unlikely that a gamer would continue examining the knife Angela gave James once they already took a look at it. Also, I find it more unlikely that people would wait till the last minute before healing themselves. Therefore, the likelihood of achieving Leave ending is much higher for most people(and therefore the ending Team Silent most likely expected most people to see). Regarding Maria ending, who hasn't looked over Mary's picture a number of times to either search for clues or just to see the image of the person James is so devastated over? Also, who here hasn't tried to see what would happen if you gave Maria the occasional 'shove' or 'love tap?' I for one didn't, but I did run pretty much everywhere, with or without Maria, and I assume most people would as well. Therefore, Maria ending would be another unlikely ending for most people, in my opinion. Obviously, all the other endings come only after you played the game at least one time, so therefore they would not be Team Silent's intended 'true ending.'

Another word on this concept of a 'true ending.' True, there is no real ending, since this is just a game. I mean, what about those Choose Your Own Adventure stories people read when they were a child? Those didn't have a 'true ending.' However, in the case of Silent Hill, I believe Team Silent stuck to one plot that pretty much evolved into one ending which could be split into three separate endings at the very end at the flick of a switch. Basically, even though what you do throughout the game affects the ending you get, it's not until the very end that the scenario changes appropriately to fit with the specific ending you achieved. In essence, Team Silent made the whole game and at the very end put a fork where people would take different turns depending on previous actions. In conclusion, however, one must rationalize what ending Team Silent would have wanted if they could choose only one. Would they choose an ending where after eight hours of gameplay James just kills himself? Or one where he takes off with this likeness of Mary by the name of Maria? I find it more likely that they would have ended it according to the screenplay in Leave ending, if they had to choose one. This is, after all, the good ending, where it all concludes.[/spoiler] Just my opinion, of course.


Well if this is true wouldn't the true ending of Silent Hill 1 be

[spoiler]The one where Harry lays dead in he jeep? I mean all you have to do is play the game without doing anything extra.[/spoiler]

Which we know isn't true due to SH 3. Not saying Leave ending isn't the true ending, but your logic is a bit flawed.


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 Post subject:

[spoiler]Perhaps you're right. However, I wouldnt base Silent Hill 2's ending on the others. Silent Hill 1 and 3 etc seem to be in the same boat, but my opinion is that Silent Hill 2 is not so much like the others. This is why I disagree with the Adversary on why Rebirth ending is true, sicne he is basing it on the otehr games that have more to do with cults, etc. But thats just my opinion. I just think Leave ending fits better. The two joke endings are obviously false, and I dont see how Rebirth ending fits, since you have to play the game again, why would Team Silent make you play the game twice to get the real ending? I think they just put that in there as an alternate ending. As for Water ending, I can't see Team Silent making a whole game just so that he commits suicide, and I can't see why Team Silent would make James continue to live a dream when Maria already died so many times, therefore making it seem as though she isn't part of the ending with James. Just my opinion, though.[/spoiler]


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RESPECT
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>sicne he is basing it on the otehr games that have more to do with cults, etc.
No I'm not. Please read the explanation again.

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Gravedigger
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Alex24 wrote:
[spoiler]As for Water ending, I can't see Team Silent making a whole game just so that he commits suicide, and I can't see why Team Silent would make James continue to live a dream when Maria already died so many times, therefore making it seem as though she isn't part of the ending with James. [/spoiler]


I understand where you're coming at, but I think it's not rational to base the game's true ending on what you've mentioned:

[spoiler]1. Gameplay
- Just because the ending is easier to get than the others doesn't mean that's the intended ending from team silent. Infact, I will argue that's probably the LEAST likely to the true ending.
- If the easiest to get ending is the true ending, then why bother to create other endings? The whole intention of replaying the game is to learn a little bit more about the story, to catch on to things that you didn't catch on the first time you played. Wouldn't that make sense when you play it one more time, you learn more; hence you get an ending closer to the "truth"? Just a thought.

2. Suicide Ending
- Now, you can't say that it doesn't make sense that team silent will create a game where the true ending is James suicide (after 8 hours of game play). James' suicide is also a form of "closure". Do you think it's more logical for a person, after killing his wife, to suicide (also consider the fact that he felt extremely guilty, and probably why he ended up in SH at the first place), or to go live a happy life with a kid?

I personally believe the "leave" ending was used as the more "general" ending because it's a more positive one. It's easier for people to take compare to the others. Whether it's the "true" ending... I guess if you like one better than the other, that's your true ending.
[/spoiler]


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Subway Guard
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For me the true ending alweays will be In Water cause is really probable that I would take that choice if I would be in the James' shoes...


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 Post subject:

I just finished the game for the firts time and got leave.
I dont know about the other endings or about references in othe rgames as to which is true, but i found it quite believable, in that
[spoiler]he is basically a nice guy and i can easily see him coming to terms with what happened and repenting so to speak. I agree with an earlier thread though that laura was an illusion. What child (theyre not retards you know) would act that stupidly in a clearly dangerous place like silent hill? She interacts with eddie, but gives him a hard time like his monsters, so its like the town invented her for james but found it could use her to taunt eddie as well.[/spoiler]


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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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MUCHO SPOILERS





okay well lemme give you my theory on Laura real quick, so basically when Mary was killed her spirit so to speak was manifested by the town her brash more wilder side became what we know as Maria i base this upon the fact that she bites James' head off in the Hospital basement when James isn't too happy to see her, Mary's other side her sweet more innocent to things side is Laura, Laura cannot see the monsters but can be seen by other people so she must be real yet the fact that she is untouched by the town is what you need to consider she is innocent and innocent spirits are not drawn to Silent Hill, now i'm sure an innocent Illusion could be created but it's a better theory to believe she was a real person born from the town just as Maria

Okay now that's out of the way, I feel that just because you get the Leave Ending first I don't think just because you get that ending first that it is the real ending, Team Silent most likely, and i say that very shakily, uses the leave ending to make the story seem like something out of a story book with a happy ending, one that people can relate to or if you don't understand the story fully one that is easier to comprehend, personally i believe there is no real ending just whatever the gamer perceives to be true, the Adversary has a good theory with the Rebirth, yet clues in Silent Hill 4 such as the dissapearance of James and Mary based on Frank's dialogue lead me to believe that the In Water Ending is the true Ending, it seems rational after taking the life of your wife that you will either A) trie your damnest to bring her back (Rebirth) or B) kill yourself to let her spirit rest, the rebirth is possible but i have a feeling that James would have stayed atleast in touch with his father and Mary no doubt would have to have some medical attention b/c of her illness which was never cured, but now i'm getting over into uncharted territory

In short i do not agree with your theory, a well written one but i disagree, and sorry for the spoilers

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RESPECT
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>i have a feeling that James would have stayed atleast in touch with his father
Anyones ideas about the relationship between James & his father are irrelevant because there's nothing to imply anything--it's all speculative & therefore doesn't really matter.

>Mary no doubt would have to have some medical attention b/c of her illness which was never cured
Valtiel is responsible for rebirthing Heather whenever she dies, yet whenever she's brought back, she's in perfect health. Valtiel is the same diety that James is conjuring for Mary's revival. Therefore, I see no see reason to not believe that Mary will return in full health.

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Gravedigger
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Very simple: If I was James and lived all that nightmare, what would I do at the end? I´d realize that there is nothing else that I can do for my wife and I´d leave the town to continue with my life.
Therefore, the realistic ending would be the Leave ending.

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Just Passing Through
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The truth is often buried deep. Claiming that the "Leave" ending is the "true" one is like just scraping on the surface and think that you can reach a definite conclusion out of the first thing that comes up. This is a complex game; in order to understand it you have to analyze it, play through it again and again, wage the different endings against each other, as well as comparing them with James' actions and behaviour through the game.

Basing the assumption that "Leave" is true merely on what the player is most likely to do on his/her first playthrough seems a bit shallow and illogical. Especially considering that the ending itself doesn’t work to good with what we learn from the game.


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Son_of_Kauffman wrote:
Very simple: If I was James and lived all that nightmare, what would I do at the end? I´d realize that there is nothing else that I can do for my wife and I´d leave the town to continue with my life.
Therefore, the realistic ending would be the Leave ending.


Exactly how I feel. I don't care about the relevance of Silent Hill 2 to other games in the series since it is quite different from the rest in my opinion. I believe in the case of Silent Hill 2 Team Silent went with a more realistic approach to the game.


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RESPECT
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>I believe in the case of Silent Hill 2 Team Silent went with a more realistic approach to the game.
That doesn't make any sense at all.

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Ghettoblaster wrote:
Especially considering that the ending itself doesn’t work to good with what we learn from the game.


I think it works perfectly well, as the Leave ending is the only ending in which James reads Mary's letter and actually does what she wants him to do.

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[spoiler]I'm a strong supporter in the "Rebirth" ending. For some reason it just clears up alot of the confusion that I had with this game. To me it makes more sence because it's a way for James to atone for his sins. (Plus I've yet to get this ending. I always miss one little element.)[/spoiler]

There use to be a thread here before the crash that pointed my feelings for this in that direction. If only it were still around...... :?

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Gravedigger
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Heh, Leave works because not only does he actually do what Mary asks him to, but

[spoiler]He probably buried her body in the cemetery as Laura looked on his sadness, realizing it pained him just as much as it did her. Cue James having his moment of silence, and leaving with the kid in tow. Well, more like the kid following him just because.

Don't forget, Mary's body was PROBABLY in the Trunk of the car... after all, where do you think he hauled it from for the Rebirth ending, or even why he would drive the car into the lake for In Water?
[/spoiler]

But, just like Mary's letter asks of him: "Do what's best for you James."

...

And that, is up to the player.

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Last edited by StinkBomber on 16 May 2006, edited 1 time in total.

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Just Passing Through
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alone in the town wrote:
I think it works perfectly well, as the Leave ending is the only ending in which James reads Mary's letter and actually does what she wants him to do.


James has gone through hell of a struggle to find Mary. He even specifically says that he would "do anything to be with her again". The concept that he simply comes to terms with her death, just gives up, and walks away - with Laura - doesn't seem very plausible to me. The last that thing Laura says to James, something like "You murderer! I hate you! I want her back!" strongly suggests that she won't let him near her again. He murdered her best friend.


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