Angela Abused: A second take (POLL)

[alone in the town]

NOTE: Before you post a result, please read through the original topic.

I understand that having multiple threads on a topic is a no-no, but I think this is a unique situation. Quite a number of opinions offered in the original poll, mine included, have changed in the interim. I don't think it's possible to reset a poll, so I'd like to see how the court of public opinion has shifted given the knowledge shared since the original poll's commencement.

If, by some miracle, this is allowed to remain, I'd be o-so-happy.

I'm actually quite curious to know the results, and I'd like them to be as informed as possible. Also, any discussion on the topic not related specifically to this poll should probably remain in that thread. I'm tiptoeing a fine line as it is. =D

edited by moderators:
please read the following links for background resources,
1) Jeremy Blaustin's article
2) Burning Man's counter-argument

[Apocali]

It was obviously sexual. After the fight with the Abstract Daddy, Angela freaks out and starts accusing James that he's trying to take advantage of her. She then goes own by pretty much flat out saying that her father beat her up into forcing her to have sex with him. I thought it was pretty clear.

[alone in the town]

That's why I suggested reading the original thread before casting your vote.

When the thread started, I agreed with you. Today, I disagree entirely. It's not nearly as obvious as it appears to be.

[Mephisto]

I, too, would say that it was a sexual abuse. Altough it might not be her father's own deeds. I think that she kinda "helped" by seducing him, thus the Seductress tablet. I didn't knew about the whole "Will you take care of me, heal all my pain" thing, that Angela was trying to seduce James but it's true, if you analyse it deeply you can tell that she's doing that.

In other words, she's the cause of her own personal Hell.
I think that she and her father had an affair but her father thought that it was wrong then he started drinking, drinking and drinking. Became a abusive violent drunk and raped her several times, didn't fucked her because she wanted to that's why she became all "scared" about sex and stuff.

But something on the symbolism contradicts that everything is sexual, the "corpses" on the flaming stairs for example, are male. Thanks to some member's "proof" I saw it more clearly. I don't know what else to think on this subject, I think she was both sexual and physically abused. And her twisted mood is strange as well, she might not be the angel that everyone seems to believe, the same can be said to Lisa's followers as well.

[Damn It All]

I'm pretty sure I remember a developer saying it was sexual during the Making of Silent Hill 2. Though I'm not sure I'll have to watch it again.

I maintain that it was sexual because of how she behaves. I'm sure its a mixture of both what she did and what happened to her, but I don't see how physical abuse alone could drive a person to such lengths. Of course, thats just my speculation.

[alone in the town]

Of course, the understanding we must have is that there is no real evidence that sexual assault took place. The only thing that is conclusive is that she was physically abused.

The reason I changed my stance from sexual to physical is because I realized that the sexual aspect is left only to assumption. While Angela states, outright, that she was 'beaten up', the sexual assault angle is supposed based on an interpretation of other things she says.

Again: Please read through the other thread and absorb both sides of the argument before placing your vote. You may see things differently by doing so!

[Damn It All]

Of course, the understanding we must have is that there is no real evidence that sexual assault took place. The only thing that is conclusive is that she was physically abused.

I agree. I think I was wrong about the developer thing but whatever the case, I'm pretty sure she was sexually abuse on top of the actual physical abuse. I think what sticks out most to me is what I said before, her general behavior leads me to believe that she was raped AND abused.

[alone in the town]

I agree. I think I was wrong about the developer thing but whatever the case, I'm pretty sure she was sexually abuse on top of the actual physical abuse. I think what sticks out most to me is what I said before, her general behavior leads me to believe that she was raped AND abused.

Yes, but that is, as I said, an assumption. Victims of severe, chronic physical abuse often act in the same manner.

[Damn It All]

I agree. I think I was wrong about the developer thing but whatever the case, I'm pretty sure she was sexually abuse on top of the actual physical abuse. I think what sticks out most to me is what I said before, her general behavior leads me to believe that she was raped AND abused.

Yes, but that is, as I said, an assumption. Victims of severe, chronic physical abuse often act in the same manner.

True, I suppose I'm just speaking from a more personal view. I've met people whom have been either physically abused or sexually and generally their moods and habits are different. However you are right in saying that its just an assumption I'm creating.

Maybe its one of those things Team Silent left ambiguous?

[Kenji]

If Team Silent did it on purpose, it was genius. For the last two years, we've been debating physical vs. sexual abuse and if/how it justifies murder. It might also say something about us that we're largely so willing to jump to such a conclusion.

[PureInsanity]

I believe that had been sexually and physically abused,but as many people already said,there isn´t enough evidence for the sexually thing,and the evidences that could support this are so unclear and can be interpreted in many ways,so I vote for the the physical-only abuse.Maybe it´s the same thing like James fate,nobody at Team Silent/Konami wants to answer this,leaving us with our own decision,if Angela got sexually AND physically abuse or not.....

[alone in the town]

It might also say something about us that we're largely so willing to jump to such a conclusion.

I think this is an excellent point. While Thomas Orosco is, unquestionably, a vile human being, Silent Hill fans have, by and large, convicted him of rape in the court of public opinion based upon the absolute flimsiest of evidence.

There are parallels to be drawn to the infamous Duke University Lacrosse Rape Case, in which three young men were almost convicted of rape simply because most people wanted to believe it was true in spite of the evidence suggesting their innocence.

[Mephisto]

Any of you guys have ever thought that Thomas Orosco could have commited suicide? And Angela is to blame with his death, therefore she's not the murderer? I'm curious, I thought about that, sometimes.

[alone in the town]

The probable cause of dea____as
multiple stab wounds to the front
of the neck and the left side of
the torso by a sharp edged
weapon.

Definitely not suicide.

[Mephisto]

I forgot about the newspaper, goddammit I must play SH2 again. Don't mind me.

[DamienPales]

An important aspect is being left unmentioned: Why was Angela abused? Just saying that her father randomly beat her for no reason is kind of a lazy thing to do, and considering how well thought-out Silent Hill 2 is in other aspects, it's not very convincing.

If you're going to argue that Angela was just getting slapped around, you have to provide a motive for Thomas to do so. Also, why just Angela? Why not her mother or brother? Why is she singled out? And whatever the reason, it has to be enough for her mother to justify it as well.

To me, only sexual abuse makes sense in this scenario. Thomas isn't interested in his son (probably 'cause he's a boy) or his wife ('cause she already gives him what he wants). This makes absolute sense. Otherwise, you've got a father beating only one of his kids for an arbitrary reason that's even murkier than claiming she was sexually abused.

[Mephisto]

>Also, why just Angela? Why not her mother or brother? Why is she singled out?

What if Thomas' wife died, or maybe his son, or both? That would left only Angela in the house (really?) with the sorrow comes the addiction (sometimes), thus he started to drink and healed his pain on his daughter.

[DamienPales]

Angela starts the game saying she's looking for her mother and brother (or maybe just her mother?). Plus, Angela says her mother was complicit in the abuse. Therefore, both of them were alive while the abuse was happening to Angela and neither of them shared her fate.

[Mephisto]

^ The strange thing is: She's looking for her father as well, didn't she killed him just hours ago? By that time Angela may have become "tainted" with the Otherworld and is having delusions.

>Therefore, both of them were alive while the abuse was happening to Angela and neither of them shared her fate.

Maybe they didn't liked her, we can assume that with the phrase "I deserved what happened, even momma said it". What if her mother participated in the beating/rape/both too? I can't say much about her brother 'cause it's all unknown, we don't know a thing about him.
But in my opinion he was only "the watcher", let's say that he's an 7 year old kiddo, he couldn't tell his father and mother to stop doing that because they would do that to him, too? And let's face it, nobody wants to get beatem or raped, unless they are masoquists, of course.

[PureInsanity]

Angela starts the game saying she's looking for her mother and brother (or maybe just her mother?). Plus, Angela says her mother was complicit in the abuse. Therefore, both of them were alive while the abuse was happening to Angela and neither of them shared her fate.

It could be farfetched,but I think if they would be alive,they would be mentioned inthis newsarticle,too.Pretty often,when I watch TV,and something happens that involves a family,be it a whole family drama or just one member of a family are often mentioned.
And I mean,Angela first visits the GRAVEYARD,a pretty strange place to look for family member.
And if she would be alive,then I don´t see a reason why Angela look in Silent Hill for her mother,without ANY evidence that her mother ever went there.