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Brookhaven Receptionist
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Missing since: 19 Aug 2005
Notes left: 751
Last seen at: Connecticut
overachiever547 wrote:
I think that the butterfly tattoo on Maria is sort of part of the illusion that she's Mary. Who knows, Mary could have gotten wild one night and stopped by a tattoo parlor for a good (painful) time. We'll never know, as Mary never shucks off that pink sweater.

Mary is part of Maria though.
I still believe that Maria is the butterfly. Though what you say makes a bit of sense, I believe it may be too elaborate.

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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 09 Sep 2006
Notes left: 2
Last seen at: Silent hill,in the middle of no where...
wow you guys notice alot....lol :shock:[code][/code][/quote]


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11387
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Um....something wrong with the second half of your post?

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 22 May 2006
Notes left: 2647
Last seen at: Bristol
overachiever547 wrote:
I think that the butterfly tattoo on Maria is sort of part of the illusion that she's Mary. Who knows, Mary could have gotten wild one night and stopped by a tattoo parlor for a good (painful) time. We'll never know, as Mary never shucks off that pink sweater.


James would have noticed the tattoo and clocked Maria straight away if Mary had gotten the same one previously. And that's the whole point of Maria - Mary would not "get wild and stop by a tattoo parlour for a good (painful) time." Whereas Maria might, because she's more exciting and impulsive like that.

Oh, and Maria isn't Mary. Per se.

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Just Passing Through
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Missing since: 16 Sep 2006
Notes left: 62
Butterflys and moths have significance in Japan because of the transition that they go through, birth-death-rebirth. Maria was created by James' guilt and possibly by the idea that Mary didn't want James to be alone after her death. But I don't think that Maria was meant to be the rebirth of Mary, she's like the evil Mary and that was all created out of James' guilt.

Just a theory, plz don't flame me if you disagree.


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Cafe5to2 Waitress
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Missing since: 23 Apr 2006
Notes left: 157
Last seen at: Newport News VA
I am only asking a question so no flaming for me either please ^_~ but isn't it like a common thing in the Silent Hill series that the beds must be bloody? Since earlyer the discussion had stated that she could have been stabbed in the back thus the blood on the bed. . . I don't think that could be the case. . . I like the smothering idea but -shrugs- just my thoughts. .


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Woodside Apartments Janitor
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Missing since: 22 Apr 2006
Notes left: 1136
Last seen at: New Jersey
St. Thomas wrote:
>Also looks like she has smacked in the face at least once
That's probably because she wouldn't shut up. Do you think Pyramid Head likes doing this? When the police come, tell them he's asleep under the front porch with his dog, Skeeter.


lol, I love when bad asses have a dog named like skittles, something so cute and adorable with a huge badass like PH haha.

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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 26 Dec 2004
Notes left: 2569
Last seen at: Insomnia land, where I am Queen!
With PH though, his dog should be named Fluffy.

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Come catch me on Twitch, probably playing Kingdom Hearts.
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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 12 Aug 2006
Notes left: 1775
Last seen at: Rhode Island
This time playing through the game, there were no flying moths at all. They were dead on the bed and floor, what gives? :|


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RESPECT
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19439
Last seen at: #lfk
They do that sometimes.

Anyway. My original theory on this matter was probably lost in the hack, but I'll go ahead and rewrite my explanation here:

Room #202 is a reference to the film "Silence of the Lambs" in it being Buffalo Bill's room--his real name is James Gumb, mind you. There are dead butterflies in the room, though there are living moths flying about. Those moths are responsible for killing the butterflies.

The key in room #208, found on the shelf, is that of room #202's--Buffalo Bill's room, remember. But the key itself is only there once the corpse shows up. That key then was probably in possession of whoever that corpse was . . . perhaps James Gumb's.

So room #208 is the resting place of Mr. Gumb but where else is there a room #208? The Abyss. From the inside of Maria's cell, you can see a room number on the door: #208. When you can actually enter that door later on, Maria is dead on the bed.

As I've established in the other thread and ages ago in this very topic, Mary = caterpillar, death = cocoon, Maria = butterfly.

Mary was the ugly caterpillar, who, when she died, went into a transformation--the cocoon: death--and has, in essence, become Maria now. They're different--just as a caterpillar is different from its butterfly-counterpart--but they're the same--which would explain why Maria has all of Mary's memories, and is regaining them slowly.

So. Maria is a butterfly, and here she is, found dead on a bed. A dead "butterfly" on a bed. . . .

Maria appears one final time on the "roof" of Lakeview Hotel--though really it's a courtroom of sorts--where she attacks by firing angry moths. But these moths are selfsame as the moths that killed the butterflies in room #202.

Strange how that all works out, all wrapped up in a neat, little package.

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. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 12 Aug 2006
Notes left: 1775
Last seen at: Rhode Island
I don't see the symbolism of Cocoon = Death. The caterpiller doesn't die, although it is "Reborn" in a sense, but I don't see Death related to a cocoon at all.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 26 Dec 2004
Notes left: 2569
Last seen at: Insomnia land, where I am Queen!
I guess it all depends on how you look at it. In the tarot deck, the death card doesn't mean death, but change. When the caterpiller goes into the coccon, it changes and is no longer a caterpiller. So in essence, the caterpiller part of it "dies" to become the butterfly.

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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 12 Aug 2006
Notes left: 1775
Last seen at: Rhode Island
I understand that, I guess I just don't like using the word/term "Death" to describe it. Fair enough.


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RESPECT
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Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19439
Last seen at: #lfk
It's called "symbolism." Mary isn't really a caterpillar and Maria isn't really a butterfly. When Mary died she went into a "transformation," thus being "reborn"--figuratively--as Maria.

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This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11387
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Basically, Mary's death is what allowed Mary to become Maria, just as the cocoon lets the caterpillar become a butterfly.

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BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 26 Dec 2004
Notes left: 2569
Last seen at: Insomnia land, where I am Queen!
I don't know if I mentioned this on this thread or not, but when I was doing a mandala for one of my art classes, I chose a butterfly. When I was researching for the project, I read that there is a Native American(I believe) belief that if you whispered a wish to a butterfly, it would fly off to the great deity of some sort and it would tell your wish and it would come true. This probably has absolutely nothing to do with the game, but it does seem that the more James mentions Mary in front of Maria, the more of Mary's memories she regains. Food for thought. :)

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Come catch me on Twitch, probably playing Kingdom Hearts.
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Woodside Apartments Janitor
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Missing since: 22 May 2007
Notes left: 1025
PeachySakura24 wrote:
I don't know if I mentioned this on this thread or not, but when I was doing a mandala for one of my art classes, I chose a butterfly. When I was researching for the project, I read that there is a Native American(I believe) belief that if you whispered a wish to a butterfly, it would fly off to the great deity of some sort and it would tell your wish and it would come true. This probably has absolutely nothing to do with the game, but it does seem that the more James mentions Mary in front of Maria, the more of Mary's memories she regains. Food for thought. :)
Maria was "born from a wish", so that actually makes sense. This is pretty interesting stuff.


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Historical Society Historian
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Missing since: 26 Dec 2004
Notes left: 2569
Last seen at: Insomnia land, where I am Queen!
Ah, here it is.
That site has some fluffy happy music playing, so beware. That is the site I used when researching my mandala.
Thinking about it, the butterfly symbolism may just be of help for Thomas and those who believe Rebirth is the canon ending. It says that if you whisper your wish to the butterfly and set it free, you are restoring balance, and your wish will surely come true. Although James' desire to have Mary back is no secret, he speaks it to Maria several times. In the Rebirth ending, he
[spoiler]kills Maria, thereby "setting her free" so to speak. He then rows Mary across the lake, [/spoiler]
where his wish will come true.

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Come catch me on Twitch, probably playing Kingdom Hearts.
Peachy's Predictions on Tumblr


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