10 Best Written Video Games
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
I'd be surprised if I could find ten well-written games, period.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Yeah, we know. You've only mentioned that several times. So sorry video game scenario writers continue to fail to live up to your standards.Kenji wrote:I'd be surprised if I could find ten well-written games, period.
...
Anyway - personally, I'd put the likes of Muriyama, Matsuno, Kojima (more for MGS 3, personally), and whoever did Suikoden V up there.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Yeah, I know, the absolute gall of me liking good things and wanting other things to be good, too. I should be ashamed of myself.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Yeah, I figured as much. Worth a (pot) shot, anyway.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Coming from someone who spares no opportunity to bash Bioware? That's called "casting stones from a glass house."
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Bioware deserves bashing - and I've done so maybe...I dunno...ten times? Maybe?
Eh, whatever. Guess it's not so surprising.
Eh, whatever. Guess it's not so surprising.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
The FIRST half life? Really? I don't even think Half Life 2 deserves #1, even though it's got a much better story. I'm having trouble fully taking this list seriously, but at least some credit was given to Silent Hill 2's deep story. For me about 2nd or 3rd sounds right. Bioshock should probably be number one, then either Silent Hill 2 or Red Dead Redemption. Those are the definite top three for me, though.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
^If you think that Red Dead is better written than the Half Life games then you are a mad man.
PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:
or, you know, entitled to your own opinion
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Oh come on, Red Dead is at least AWESOME. Not the old one... the new 360/ps3 one! I didn't dig the story as a whole too much until after the end, after I started from the beginning again. Ehhhh, Half Life's story is certainly good, dont get me wrong... I just think these other games are so much better executed. Aside from Half Life 2. haha. (Ever seen Freeman's Mind on youtube? That's hilarious!!!) And I do like your spoiler. This is truestopped_clock wrote:^If you think that Red Dead is better written than the Half Life games then you are a mad man.
PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:or, you know, entitled to your own opinion
Also, what I just realized, is Shattered Memories may be in my top 3....oops.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Gotta agree that Half Life is better written than Red Dead, but that's not saying much. Red Dead is an awesome game, but writing is not it's strong point.
There's not a whole lot of well written games, actually, and the type of games that are on this list kinda shows that. I mean, I love Shadow of the Colossus, and it has great *storytelling,* but that's not the same thing as writing. Mass Effect is a good game but not for it's writing... the story is really generic Micheal Bay type stuff, like most modern games today aspire to be.
Of all the Metal Gears, 3 was probably the best written, and I might put it in the top 10. The Boss character was really well written. Silent Hill 2 absolutely deserves a spot. Also it's crazy that Planescape isn't on there... I'm not personally a big fan, but it's pretty widely considered to be one of the best written games of all time.
There's not a whole lot of well written games, actually, and the type of games that are on this list kinda shows that. I mean, I love Shadow of the Colossus, and it has great *storytelling,* but that's not the same thing as writing. Mass Effect is a good game but not for it's writing... the story is really generic Micheal Bay type stuff, like most modern games today aspire to be.
Of all the Metal Gears, 3 was probably the best written, and I might put it in the top 10. The Boss character was really well written. Silent Hill 2 absolutely deserves a spot. Also it's crazy that Planescape isn't on there... I'm not personally a big fan, but it's pretty widely considered to be one of the best written games of all time.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Are we talking Half Life 1 or 2? I've played 2, and I don't really consider making the player search out environmental details like news clippings that only give you an at best vague understanding of what the hell is going on to be good writing. The game was fun, though.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Yeah, I can't believe there was no love at all for Kojima. I'm a huge fan of the MGS series and for not even one to be on there is a damn shame. I also really love the tories for ShadowHearts 1&2. I thought they were pretty well done. Covenant in particular.
Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
People think MGS3's story is better than the previous titles because of what, exactly? All I see is because of The Boss this, The Boss that. . .
I may commit a sacrilege for saying this, esp. because this is one of my favorite series of all time, but MGS3's story was just a regular WW2 story full of spies and the inside intel working to fix the holes. And it tells the story of Big Boss. Solid Snake is a better character, imo.
Sure, it talks about loyalty and other personal things but I believe that MGS2 deserves the best award.
Not missing the fact that because of people who call themselves "fans" many things were stripped from the MGS3 story. Never listen to your fans again, Hideo.
MGS2 was daring in it's plot. And from the very start it wanted to fuck with the player's mind. Conspiracy theories everywhere, treason, a character with no backstory at all.
It's like the Matrix movies. I believe Kojima was showing, with this title, that we have to see beyond than what is shown to us.
. . .
The past Elder Scrolls titles, and also Oblivion, are very rich with their lore and they never fail on such a thing. But I agree that Oblivion's main story was kind of a letdown.
. . .
I would add Shadow of the Colossus and Mass Effect to the "best written" list.
Hell, I would even add Mortal Kombat. Fighting games with good story? That's news.
The story of this series is very confusing but also rewarding. You have to play from the very beggining to understand what everything is all about. And it's "lore", if that's the right thing for such title, is really well done. But since Ed Boon changed a few things the story won't be the same.
. . .
Silent Hill 2, along with Silent Hill 4 deserves the spot as well. Konami failed on gameplay and with the main character on #4 but it's story is one of the best, imo.
I may commit a sacrilege for saying this, esp. because this is one of my favorite series of all time, but MGS3's story was just a regular WW2 story full of spies and the inside intel working to fix the holes. And it tells the story of Big Boss. Solid Snake is a better character, imo.
Sure, it talks about loyalty and other personal things but I believe that MGS2 deserves the best award.
Not missing the fact that because of people who call themselves "fans" many things were stripped from the MGS3 story. Never listen to your fans again, Hideo.
MGS2 was daring in it's plot. And from the very start it wanted to fuck with the player's mind. Conspiracy theories everywhere, treason, a character with no backstory at all.
It's like the Matrix movies. I believe Kojima was showing, with this title, that we have to see beyond than what is shown to us.
. . .
The past Elder Scrolls titles, and also Oblivion, are very rich with their lore and they never fail on such a thing. But I agree that Oblivion's main story was kind of a letdown.
. . .
I would add Shadow of the Colossus and Mass Effect to the "best written" list.
Hell, I would even add Mortal Kombat. Fighting games with good story? That's news.
The story of this series is very confusing but also rewarding. You have to play from the very beggining to understand what everything is all about. And it's "lore", if that's the right thing for such title, is really well done. But since Ed Boon changed a few things the story won't be the same.
. . .
Silent Hill 2, along with Silent Hill 4 deserves the spot as well. Konami failed on gameplay and with the main character on #4 but it's story is one of the best, imo.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
The list isn't necessarily talking about best story...just best written.
Overall, the list is somewhat of a joke.
Overall, the list is somewhat of a joke.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
I might have gotten a little carried away with my words. . . But when I was talking about story I meant about how the plot was well written as well. At least when I was thinking, and not "wording" my thoughts.
People who make such lists (yeah. . . me, you, and everyone else included) tends to choose things that they like and not choose the things as. . . Facts.
Every list is gong to be a joke, no matter what.Overall, the list is somewhat of a joke.
People who make such lists (yeah. . . me, you, and everyone else included) tends to choose things that they like and not choose the things as. . . Facts.
Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
It's definitely difficult to separate what one likes from what is actually good, nevermind that there are several definitions of what is "good."
The most stable definition of quality comes in terms of sales and longevity. That people will continue to buy it for years and years afterward means that they still value it enough to part with whatever sum of cash is being asked for. Super Mario Bros. being one of the greatest (if not the greatest) games of all time is not merely the opinion of a bunch of retro gamers, but also the opinion of the market that keeps buying rereleases, even twenty-five years later.
Of course, because stories aren't the main reason most people buy games, how well the story is written doesn't figure that much into why people love a game. Again, Super Mario Bros., while beloved over generations, is not gonna win awards for its sharp storytelling. If anything, the virtue of its story is that it never gets in the way.
That last bit is why you won't see me criticizing SMB's story. Not only is the story not the point of the game, it never demands my attention. Much of my criticism of games' stories revolve around their demand for my attention, coupled with their low quality. If they were better, or if they didn't demand my attention like they often do, I'd have no reason to say anything.
I have more to say on the subject, for the sake of clarification, but I'll get to it later.
The most stable definition of quality comes in terms of sales and longevity. That people will continue to buy it for years and years afterward means that they still value it enough to part with whatever sum of cash is being asked for. Super Mario Bros. being one of the greatest (if not the greatest) games of all time is not merely the opinion of a bunch of retro gamers, but also the opinion of the market that keeps buying rereleases, even twenty-five years later.
Of course, because stories aren't the main reason most people buy games, how well the story is written doesn't figure that much into why people love a game. Again, Super Mario Bros., while beloved over generations, is not gonna win awards for its sharp storytelling. If anything, the virtue of its story is that it never gets in the way.
That last bit is why you won't see me criticizing SMB's story. Not only is the story not the point of the game, it never demands my attention. Much of my criticism of games' stories revolve around their demand for my attention, coupled with their low quality. If they were better, or if they didn't demand my attention like they often do, I'd have no reason to say anything.
I have more to say on the subject, for the sake of clarification, but I'll get to it later.
Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Well the games I believe should have at least made it into the list...
-Heavy Rain
-Alpha Protocol (while buggy, the writing was great)
-Planescape: Torment.
-Baldur's Gate 2 SoA + ToB
-Dragon Age: Origins
-Metal Gear Solid 1 or 3.
I do agree with Fahrenheit in a way... The second half of that game... No comment.
Oblivion... A joke, the storyline was boring.
Half-life, while an amazing game, it seems that whoever made the list mixed up writing with scripting.
EDIT: How could I forget Chrono Trigger? As much as I hate JRPGs this one is good.
-Heavy Rain
-Alpha Protocol (while buggy, the writing was great)
-Planescape: Torment.
-Baldur's Gate 2 SoA + ToB
-Dragon Age: Origins
-Metal Gear Solid 1 or 3.
I do agree with Fahrenheit in a way... The second half of that game... No comment.
Oblivion... A joke, the storyline was boring.
Half-life, while an amazing game, it seems that whoever made the list mixed up writing with scripting.
EDIT: How could I forget Chrono Trigger? As much as I hate JRPGs this one is good.
Last edited by Sergiy on 10 Jul 2011, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
As much as I enjoyed the game, there are far too many plot holes for me to agree with this.Sergiy wrote:-Heavy Rain
Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
Maybe it's because I played through the game in one sitting, but I did not realize any.Typographenia wrote:As much as I enjoyed the game, there are far too many plot holes for me to agree with this.Sergiy wrote:-Heavy Rain
Re: 10 Best Written Video Games
I don't like the Heavy Rain story largely because I couldn't bring myself to give a damn about Ethan's son, no matter how much the game demanded that I care. However, what makes Heavy Rain fail as a story is the plot twist.
At that point, the story breaks its internal rules (both gameplay and narrative) just so it can play a cheap trick.
Up to this point, and following this point, the player is given access to the thoughts of the character s/he is playing. It's like a first-person POV in a book, with that POV switching between chapters. The understood contract of first-person POV is that we are witnessing the character's thoughts and feelings, presumably as they're thinking and feeling them. Deliberately keeping the first-person POV character's thoughts from the reader is like that character keeping those same thoughts from himself. It makes no sense and, again, plays like a cheap parlor trick.
Not only did David Cage lie to us in the narrative contract, but also in the gameplay contract.
At that point, the story breaks its internal rules (both gameplay and narrative) just so it can play a cheap trick.
Up to this point, and following this point, the player is given access to the thoughts of the character s/he is playing. It's like a first-person POV in a book, with that POV switching between chapters. The understood contract of first-person POV is that we are witnessing the character's thoughts and feelings, presumably as they're thinking and feeling them. Deliberately keeping the first-person POV character's thoughts from the reader is like that character keeping those same thoughts from himself. It makes no sense and, again, plays like a cheap parlor trick.
PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER_SHOW PRIME_BBCODE_SPOILER:
So, Scott Shelby is outed as the murderer. Not only is he outed as the murderer, despite none of his thoughts indicating that he kidnaps and kills children in service of an obsession, but he's also shown to be killing that typewriter store clerk, something that obviously never happened because the player was there.
Because the hook of the game is choice, it's doubly damning because every choice that the player had made, which defined Shelby as a character, is rendered moot. The tired hero Shelby that I had carefully constructed was instantly replaced by a sneering, child-killing bastard.
Because the hook of the game is choice, it's doubly damning because every choice that the player had made, which defined Shelby as a character, is rendered moot. The tired hero Shelby that I had carefully constructed was instantly replaced by a sneering, child-killing bastard.