SH 5: A Complete Disappointment

[Travis]

^The alternate hospital from SH3 is the shit, but I still prefer the otherworld areas of SH1.

[SPRINGS02]

Yeah the alternate hospital was extremely disturbing to me i've never seen anything like it or close. And i still need to play through silent hill 1 its the only silent hill i haven't played.

[KageReneko]

Alternate Hospital in SH3 is what makes that game worthy... The puzzles, the walls, Valtiel taking that nirse to the corner, the seal of metatron painted in the basement, the puzzles, the birthday call, the mirror room, the hand in the window, EVERYTHING!! Man that level is just intense... All the other levels feel a but plain after you beat the Hospital....

[SPRINGS02]

ehh i don't know the church was pretty messed up too.

[Girl Interrupted]

I don't have anything against people who have their own opinions, but you should see things more objectively.

For example, I liked SH4 a lot. In fact, a lot more than SH3. But I can't deny it had a horrible gameplay system. And I don't say that the gameplay is that way because, I don't know, Henry's body is kind of numb due to the lack of nutrition and exercise because he was trapped in his apartment for a long time.

Fact: I liked the new combat system in Homecoming. Not only did I enjoy it but it also went with the story and its character.

I'm all about realism when it comes to games (and movies). So any little detail that is used in a videogame will only make me appreciate it and enjoy it even more.

Also, if you were complaining about SH4's combat system, what the hell was wrong with it? The fighting in that game was barely different from the previous 3 games. I would go as far as saying that it's better than the other 3 games (and more realistic because the more Henry swings, the better his attacks are).

But the thing that I didn't like was the fact that you couldn't carry as many items in the game like you can in the other games. It's realistic (which I like) but it does make the game more frustrating and loose replay value. Despite that, I still consider it my favorite game in this series because of its story.

[rawker]

Will be replaying Homecoming... for the nth time. I love to challenge myself. On my last play-through, I beat Amnion only with the Ceremonial Dagger. Actually, it was a careless mistake... I was rushing the game too much, that I forgot to bring along my loot bag. I was a bit pissed when I can't get my stuff back but heck, I gave it a try. I was a bit amused to find out that I did it with just melee. Although it took me thrice the amount of time to kill it without guns.

All in all, this game wasn't really a disappointment. It's just that people are expecting too much or comparing this game to others. Comparing it to games like L4D, DS or RE series is not a good idea since every game mentioned are good in their own ways. Truly, one will surpass at one/more aspect/s... That's why it's rather unfair to do those comparisons. To me, for as long as you find enjoyment to the game you bought, it automatically counts as a good game since it's the aim of every game - if you're forgetting it.

[Skele]

i actually really enjoyed homecoming, but i did feel that there was room for improvement in some areas. i really wish there was more of SG to explore. it felt like the town was the size of an entire block. i felt the story was good, but could've been much better had the twist regarding Alex & Josh been more disturbing. not only would it have made more sense to have PH in the game (if they would've went with my idea), but it also would've made Alex the best protagonist, ever! i won't even go into great detail about the women's hair in that game, and how bad they look in the cutscenes...

all of the things dealing with SG and SH i liked quite a bit, though. how the towns had a pact, and how the families had their responsibilities and secrets.

the combat was great IMO... i loved it tbh. there's nothing i'd change about it.

[Ravager]

And what's up with judge Holloway? She's supposed to be 53, but doesn't look like that.

[Travis]

^It's called the inversed Dahlia syndrome.

[angelofROOM302]

I thought Judge Holloway actually looked her age.

[OsirisZero]

Maybe the lack of imagination, creativity and effort from the developers... Every Silent Hill game had unique monsters that gave an original feeling and an identity... Homecoming just took creatures from the movie that were an homage of Silent Hill 1 and 2...

Homecoming's original creatures were cool and deadly (Siams, Needlers and Schisms), the bosses were really cool so they didn't need to rip from the movie... That was just lazy from them... All the order shit was that ruined the game for me... Without the order the game would be as good like the previous titles... We have to admit it... To make a Silent Hill game isn't easy, you need to be careful with every little detail and you have to create a story that really touch the player... Double Helix couldn't do all this so they just stopped half way and started tpo adapt stuff from other sources...

I still wondering why didn't they located Homecoming in Brahms... That would be a lot more interesting... They just created a town from nowhere...

Exactly.

But the only enemies it takes from the movie are Pyramid Head (in design only), the Nurses (which did kinda suck, I'll admit), and the Order Soldiers. All three of these are justified, with the possible exception of the Nurses.

AND Smog, which is basically the skin straitjacket guy from the movie, which is basically the skin straitjacket guy from Silent Hill 2. Only on fire. (Because underground coal fire, lolz)

And still no, none of them them are justified (except the nurses, which are basically a staple of EVERY Silent Hill game. And hey let's face it, every game needs its Cid, its crowbar, and its cardboard box)

If it wasn't for the incorporation of the SH movie in Homecoming, I probably wouldn't have hated it nearly as much.

I don't really understand this. What's so offensive about the movie's aesthetics?

That's the point though.

This is a video game, which means that visuals (especially in this sort of game) have a lot to do with your experience of it. They adapted too much from the movie, which doesn't exactly represent the series, and if you basically "grew up" with the games then this is easily noticeable and it kinda kicks you out of the game. All the while making you facepalm yourself repeatedly.

Sure, I'd say that to most Silent Hill newbs the movie probably does 'represent the series' because it was their first experience of it, and which is why they tend to LOVE SH:H and get really, really confused or mad when you don't (because it vibes with their original experience of the series (movie), just like my original experience is with Silent Hill 1)

It's like how most people who grew up playing Final Fantasy VII think it was the best of the series, when other think it was VI or IX, or maybe even X-2 somehow.

[MooseFlanagan]

That's the point though.

This is a video game, which means that visuals (especially in this sort of game) have a lot to do with your experience of it. They adapted too much from the movie, which doesn't exactly represent the series, and if you basically "grew up" with the games then this is easily noticeable and it kinda kicks you out of the game. All the while making you facepalm yourself repeatedly.

Sure, I'd say that to most Silent Hill newbs the movie probably does 'represent the series' because it was their first experience of it, and which is why they tend to LOVE SH:H and get really, really confused or mad when you don't (because it vibes with their original experience of the series (movie), just like my original experience is with Silent Hill 1)

It's like how most people who grew up playing Final Fantasy VII think it was the best of the series, when other think it was VI or IX, or maybe even X-2 somehow.

Silent Hill 2 is the Final Fantasy VII of the series, though. Silent Hill 2 is the one the newbs love, and I say this as someone whose first game was Silent Hill 2. The entire series will always be in 2's shadow. That's why 4 was as different as it was, and why Origins and Homecoming try new things like a non-sucky combat system, human enemies, the mirror thing etc. The movie is disliked by almost all Silent Hill fans as far as I've seen, or at the very least they accept it's a dumbing-down of the games.

And I can understand why you don't like to see movie stuff 'polluting' the main series. Personally, I liked it, because the aesthetics were the only part of the movie I liked, and I thought they were far better implemented in Homecoming. And again, people massively overexaggerate the presence of movie stuff in the game. As they do with Wheeler's presence. Or the Order Soldiers. Or the "lack of symbolism for the monsters". Or...well, everything negative in it.

I'll admit Homecoming has flaws, as do all games, and it certainly isn't my favourite entry in the series. But I almost feel sorry for Double Helix; they've clearly tried, but it's a fact that the game could've been the best entry in the series and the fans would've disliked it.

[KageReneko]

The smokes are Patient demons mixed with the gray children from the movie... Double ripoff...

[Kaisura]

Personally, my only disappointments with Silent Hill: Homecoming have to do with the fandom itself.

1) That so many people bash it because it was made by Climax.

2) That so many people bash it because it took artistic cues from the movie, despite the fact those artistic cues came from Akira Y.

3) That so few people seem to actually acknowledge that "5" was removed from the title and replaced with "Homecoming" to acknowledge the fact that it isn't a "core" saga installment, but a story set in the same universe.

It didn't attempt to answer; and thus didn't damage, ruin, or skew, established fact. It didn't impose anything on the player that it shouldn't have. It remained nicely contained within its own little bubble of fiction.

And trust me - I have the PC version, with all its flaws, glitches, and bugs - it is a true bastard-child of a PC port. But that doesn't make it a bad game, either. SH2's port wasn't all that terribly well done, it was plagued with problems originally (it needed a patch to simply work on Nvidia based graphics cards, there were sound skipping/looping issues, to this day you have to manually set the process affinity to one single core or it screws up). That doesn't make Silent Hill 2 a bad game.

Besides. However misguided they -may- have been (I don't personally think they were. I think they just weren't completely clear on what they wanted to do), they -were- puretin enough to put the radio and flashlight back in after Silent Hill 4 removed them from the gameplay model.

Of course I don't presume for a moment I could change anyone's mind, nor have I the interest do so (much less with my first post). I'm just rather reassured to see the voices of reasons seeping through in this thread, pertaining to how Homecoming ... you know, wasn't the antichrist of Silent Hill.

[AuraTwilight]

1) That so many people bash it because it was made by Climax.

It was made by Double Helix, lol.

It didn't attempt to answer; and thus didn't damage, ruin, or skew, established fact. It didn't impose anything on the player that it shouldn't have. It remained nicely contained within its own little bubble of fiction.

Yea, but it did pretty much warp Silent Hill's religious and historical past, and inserted an entire town into canon in a place that should be impossible (Brahams is supposed to be the closest town, but Shepherd's Glenn is just on the other side of the lake). Along with having all sorts of plot holes, aside. Alex's Journal also does try and pass off speculations as fact.

[MooseFlanagan]

Yea, but it did pretty much warp Silent Hill's religious and historical past, and inserted an entire town into canon in a place that should be impossible (Brahams is supposed to be the closest town, but Shepherd's Glenn is just on the other side of the lake). Along with having all sorts of plot holes, aside. Alex's Journal also does try and pass off speculations as fact.

Other than the Brahms thing, how did it mess with Silent Hill's past?

Not trying to start an argument here, but I'm geniunely curious. I might've been playing more casually, but I didn't really notice anything like that. Shephard's Glen and its branch of the Order is an obvious retcon, sure, but I don't recall it really "warping" much. Maybe I just don't know the past of SH too well.

[Kaisura]

It was made by Double Helix, lol.

Yeah. I actually know that, but somehow managed to type Climax instead. It's always one or the other that gets bashed.

Yea, but it did pretty much warp Silent Hill's religious and historical past, and inserted an entire town into canon in a place that should be impossible (Brahams is supposed to be the closest town, but Shepherd's Glenn is just on the other side of the lake). Along with having all sorts of plot holes, aside. Alex's Journal also does try and pass off speculations as fact.

Did it? It seemed to me that all Homecoming did was create a splinter faction of The Order. Not actually change the existing order, but fabricate the existence of a group that split off from the original organization to found their own branch of the religion. That doesn't actually change the history of The Order itself.

As for the geographical point, I'm not so sure that's necessarily true. Who's to say Brahms isn't as close -as- close as Shephard's Glenn? We don't know exactly how long that boat ride across Toluca Lake was, and Toluca Lake is apparently much bigger than it seems (the Little Baronness wasn't exactly a small ship...)

They didn't touch Mary, despite the name alteration prior to release to match her maiden surname. They didn't touch James. They didn't touch Laura. They made a referrence to Cybil, in a sort of vague way. They didn't touch Heather, or Henry, or Eileeeeeeeeen. Or Walter, for that matter.

I dunno. It seemed to me Homecoming was pretty self-contained. The most invasive thing I saw in it was the fact you actually go to Silent Hill and it presents its own iteration of the Central Silent Hill district.

As for Alex's diary ... I've read those, I don't recall seeing speculation passed off as fact. o_O

[December Man]

I'm just rather reassured to see the voices of reasons seeping through in this thread, pertaining to how Homecoming ... you know, wasn't the antichrist of Silent Hill.

Blasphemy! Burn the witch!

But seriously, I'm happy you're one of the five people who see Homecoming wasn't "OMFG IT IS TEH SUXXXOR!!11!". I applaud to you my lady!

[AuraTwilight]

Or Walter, for that matter.

Well, actually, there is a recorded psychological interview with Walter in the game that went unused, as one can see by going into the game data. Minor nitpick.

Other than the Brahms thing, how did it mess with Silent Hill's past?

Well, for one thing, it pretty much cemented the Order as "random evil cult of kidnapping and killing bitches for little to no reason", when it's made pretty explicit that people like Dahlia are in the severe minority.

As for Alex's diary ... I've read those, I don't recall seeing speculation passed off as fact. o_O

Not the online blog thing, the PDF you can download. It has Alex talking about his adventure, and apparently learning about what happened in the other game and presenting his theories in a Plot Guide style.

As for the geographical point, I'm not so sure that's necessarily true. Who's to say Brahms isn't as close -as- close as Shephard's Glenn? We don't know exactly how long that boat ride across Toluca Lake was, and Toluca Lake is apparently much bigger than it seems (the Little Baronness wasn't exactly a small ship...)

if you combine the maps from the first two games, you see that Toluca Lake...isn't all that wide and large. The Little Baronness was extraordinary BECAUSE it was so weird for it to be lost like that.

Plus Brahams is like atleast 11.9-ish miles away (or 119 miles mirite?) While Brahams is, well, on the other side of a lake that doesn't even seem to be more than seven or eight miles at best.

[Kaisura]

The young-Walter interviews with Fitch were never used. Otherwise I'd have agreed with you on that point.

As for Toluca Lake ... I dunno, I take it with a pinch of salt myself. It doesn't seem like Team Silent ever really decided how big they wanted that lake to be, themselves. The fact later developers are still trying to nut it out isn't really their fault, though.

As for the distance between Shephard's Glenn and Silent Hill versus Brahms and Silent Hill. You realize, technically, Brahms is still closer, even if the trip across the lake is shorter, right?

It's not a trick question. The trip to SG by boat may very well be shorter, but that's across the lake. The trip to it by car would involve going right around the lake, which would be longer than the distance to Brahms, if you actually measured it out.

Of course, I'm not saying Double Helix realized that ... I rather doubt it even factored into their thinking, honestly. But for the sake of argument, it would seem to be a valid point.