Search FAQ

Login | Register


All times are UTC [ DST ]


It is currently 16 Dec 2019




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 284 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 ... 15  Next
Author Message

Moderator
 Post subject:

Missing since: 21 Jul 2003
Notes left: 11979
Last seen at: Nova Scotia, Canada
MMY wrote:
The puppet nurses and doctors are officially the nurses and doctors of Alchemilla Hospital parasitized and thus controlled by said parasite. Lost Memories: Silent Hill Chronicles indicates so in the Silent Hill section: "A nurse that has been parasitized by something." The book does not read "a manifestation," but instead matter-of-factly asseverates "a nurse."



The Bubble Head Nurses in SH2 and the Nurses in SH3 are not referred to as manifestations in LM either. Are you supposing that James is walking around Brookhaven in Silent Hill 2 butchering innocent nurses? Same with Heather?

You know, if that was the case, I don't see how either hospital could hire a new staff. Who would apply? How would the interview go?

"Why did this position open up?"
"Oh, all the nurses died."
"All of them?"
"Yes, all of them. Fortunately we have a great life insurance benefit."

_________________
"I dreamt last night I saw you
A single spark explosion negotiating with the dead
By the bright lights in some ICU on my chest you put your head
and said "There you are.
There you are.
There's my heart..."


Top
   
 

Cafe5to2 Waitress
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 27 Jan 2007
Notes left: 274
Last seen at: Ry'leh
Burning Man wrote:
FatalFrame wrote:
But she wasn't using the seal only for that purpose, she was also using it to hide herself from Dahlia.

Are you sure?


Dahlia says it herself in SH1

_________________
Are you ready to begin your trip to the Otherside
Death is an old friend of mine


Top
   
 

RESPECT
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
>The Bubble Head Nurses in SH2 and the Nurses in SH3 are not referred to as manifestations in LM
The Bubble Head Nurses are not referred to explicitly as "nurses," either. However, the nurses in Silent Hill 3 are simply called Nurse, and Lost Memories: Silent Hill Chronicle writes, "It may be that the nurses of the hospital transformed into monsters, but the details are unclear." So, yes, there's a possibility that the nurses in SH3 are humans, too. Chrissie is evidence of this.

And, of course: Neither version of the nurses in Silent Hill 2 nor Silent Hill 3 have parasites, so yr point is mostly moot.

The parasite controls the puppet nurses/doctors. The parasite controls Cybil when she's "infected." Cybil is a human. The nurses/doctors, then, are also human. Why exactly would a parasite need to control a manifestation that is already allegedly under Alessa's control? as you suggest. That just doesn't make sense. Like, at all.

>Dahlia says it herself in SH1
Dahlia is a liar. Do you believe everything she says?

_________________
This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


Top
   
 

Historical Society Historian
 Post subject:

Missing since: 15 Jul 2003
Notes left: 2368
FatalFrame wrote:
Dahlia says it herself in SH1

Sorry, which dialog are you referring to?

MMY wrote:
So, yes, there's a possibility that the nurses in SH3 are humans, too.

Indeed. Silent Hill 3 toys around with the idea of transfigurement, so Droo's claim that "The monsters are ALL manifestations in ALL the games" would be false, anyway.

Still, Droo doesn't seem to be interested in explaining Cybil.

_________________
© 2003-2009 Burning Man.
The contents of this post may only be used within the boundaries of www.silenthillforum.com.
Any usage outside of the aforementioned forum is strictly prohibited.


Top
   
 

Moderator
 Post subject:

Missing since: 21 Jul 2003
Notes left: 11979
Last seen at: Nova Scotia, Canada
MMY wrote:
Why exactly would a parasite need to control a manifestation that is already allegedly under Alessa's control? as you suggest.


For symbolic reasons. It's representative of one of Alessa's fears, not representative of their function.

I just don't believe that Harry cut a swath through the entire staff of Alchemilla. It doesn't seem like something Alessa would do, especially when we know she can manifest creatures all on her own.

Cybil is an exception to this. Alessa may be soft-hearted, but she's not stupid. Cybil posed a threat. Thus. Alessa co-opted one of her symbols to remove her.

_________________
"I dreamt last night I saw you
A single spark explosion negotiating with the dead
By the bright lights in some ICU on my chest you put your head
and said "There you are.
There you are.
There's my heart..."


Top
   
 

Historical Society Historian
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11384
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Quote:
Why? What is there to support this idea? None of the other monsters in the entire series have been anything close to real.


Missionary, Scrapers, Leonard...I'm sorry, you were saying?

_________________
BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


Top
   
 

Historical Society Historian
 Post subject:

Missing since: 15 Jul 2003
Notes left: 2368
Droo wrote:
I just don't believe that Harry cut a swath through the entire staff of Alchemilla.

The entire staff is all dead. Harry is not cutting through live people here. Think of them as zombies if you have to.

Droo wrote:
Cybil is an exception to this.

There's really no reason to apply one rule to a group, and apply another one for Cybil specifically, when one answer can explain it all.

Quote:
Alessa may be soft-hearted, but she's not stupid. Cybil posed a threat. Thus. Alessa co-opted one of her symbols to remove her.

"Go forth my minion and destroy her!!"

_________________
© 2003-2009 Burning Man.
The contents of this post may only be used within the boundaries of www.silenthillforum.com.
Any usage outside of the aforementioned forum is strictly prohibited.


Top
   
 


 Post subject:

Well this is what i think!

[spoiler]<SH Origins Part>

•Lisa was a trainee nurse that met w/ Kaufmann in a staff party(Letter in the Alchemilla Hospital)
•They said Alessa died(but she didn't)
•Kaufmann got Lisa addicted to the drug
•Travis found Lisa in the theater maybe because she was on her way to the motel but had to do something in the theater(i wonder what)
•Travis walks in on Kaufmann & Lisa in the motel room, after that we see white powder on some surface(Lisa is addicted)
•Travis going out of Silent Hill(Canon Ending)

<After SH0,Before SH1 Theories>
•Lisa stole the baby maybe with Alessa's guidance
♦Harry and his wife finding a baby(Cheryl)
♦Kaufmann killed Lisa(because of the delay in the ritual with the loss of the baby)
♦Dahlia and Kaufmann talking about the other half being lost and using a summoning spell(lets not forget the other 2 or 3 doctors with Dahlia & Kaufmann in SH1)

{3 Diamonds meaning i don't know what comes first}


<SH1 Part> (Well i haven't played SH1 but i kinda understand the story)(W8ing for the SH1 Remake for PSP!

•Harry goes to Silent Hill w/ Cheryl
•They had an accident w/ the car
•Cheryl was lost(maybe merged w/ Alessa)
•Harry meeting Kaufmann,Cybil,Dahlia
•Harry finding "Lisa" under the table in Alchemilla Hospital
•Cybil's Death(Deputy Wheeler in SHH saying a cop(woman)went to SH and never came back)
•Lisa's Transformation
•The awakening of Incubus/Incubator(Based on actions in-game)
•Getting Heather(Canon Ending)

<The Lisa Garland Theory>

Lets start in SH1!

Cheryl was merged w/ Alessa when they came to Silent Hill. Meaning she got back her full powers. So she resurrected Lisa in the Otherworld.*SKIP* So Lisa was found by Harry under the table in Other Alchemilla. Lisa was helping Harry about things in Silent Hill. But since she was resurrected in the Other Alchemilla Hospital, she was brought back BUT with a monster part. Since Alessa was in control over the Otherworld, she(Alessa) was able to put the monster Lisa part to sleep mode.
But the monster part had a possibility of a short wake-up.

Short Wake Up Scenes:

In the Intro, the first two scenes with Lisa getting out from under the table to hug Harry. Here's a run through

•The flashlight focuses on Lisa, Lisa sees Harry then gets out from under the table. While getting out, she looks down(a short wake up) and stands up. She makes a motion to "hug" Harry. Look at her face when she's about to hug Harry. Use a PSP's Slow Motion/Frame *something*/Pause then look at her face. So after "hugging" Harry, from her face looking down, her head motions to face Harry. When she's about to face him, use Slow Mo/Frame *something/Pause to look at her. Then she blinks(Sleep Mode again) and smiles at Harry
•Harry wakes up, Lisa's eye twitches

So then when Harry used the Flauros against Alessa, Alessa lost her powers. So that means she lost her control over the monster Lisa part. So that means The Human Lisa part lastly held to Harry's comfort for control since she always wanted Harry beside her cause she says she feels good with him. Thats also why Lisa was saying
Quote:
Stay with me Harry, please, save me from them.
So when Harry pushed Lisa away, she lost the last lifeline she had so she slowly bled and was being slowly overcome by the now-awake Monster Lisa part.[/spoiler]

So its Harry's fault?


Top
   
 

RESPECT
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
>For symbolic reasons. It's representative of one of Alessa's fears, not representative of their function.
Except that the parasite's function is officially explained as such. . . .

>I just don't believe that Harry cut a swath through the entire staff of Alchemilla.
As Burning Man said, the staff is dead. Alessa was capable of killing the town's developers, remember? as she was asked by her mother. Well, she was fully capable of doing the same to those she felt responsible for her condition: the staff. As far as she knows, the staff kept her alive.

>especially when we know she can manifest creatures all on her own.
Again, as Burning Man said—and, more importantly, is explained in Lost Memories: Silent Hill Chronicle: "It's the power of the town that manifests something from one's subconscious." The creations aren't conscious constructs—Alessa didn't think, "Okay, I want some little kids w/ knives that represent the jackoff that etched into my desk, and I want some flying bird-like monsters representative of my love for Crichton novels, and I want some . . ."

We know this for a fact b/c of Silent Hill 2. The monsters are the manifestations of James—and to a certain extent Mary—but neither of them consciously created & designed the monsters. The same is applicable to Alessa.

In the case of the puppet nurses/doctors, all that was manifested were the parasites, which then took over the husks of the staff.

>Cybil is an exception to this.
Why is Cybil an exception? From Alessa's perspective, so, too, does the hospital staff pose a threat.

You're not at all being consistent. Consistency is imperative to understanding & appreciating the series.

_________________
This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


Top
   
 

Moderator
 Post subject:

Missing since: 21 Jul 2003
Notes left: 11979
Last seen at: Nova Scotia, Canada
When did the entire staff die? Does that mean Kaufmann is already dead, too? Dahlia?

_________________
"I dreamt last night I saw you
A single spark explosion negotiating with the dead
By the bright lights in some ICU on my chest you put your head
and said "There you are.
There you are.
There's my heart..."


Top
   
 

Just Passing Through
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 16 Feb 2009
Notes left: 70
Last seen at: united socialist republic of hope
Well Lisa does say "I'm the same as them I just hadn't noticed it before"
So is she already dead and she has a parasite we just can't see on her back?
But why is Kaufmann not dead? I'm trying to see consistancy here but it's difficult for me from all angles.


Top
   
 

Cafe5to2 Waitress
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 27 Jan 2007
Notes left: 274
Last seen at: Ry'leh
Burning Man wrote:
FatalFrame wrote:
Dahlia says it herself in SH1

Sorry, which dialog are you referring to?

I'm pretty sure that at the amusement park when she finally finds Alessa is where she says it.

_________________
Are you ready to begin your trip to the Otherside
Death is an old friend of mine


Top
   
 

Historical Society Historian
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 01 Aug 2006
Notes left: 11384
Last seen at: I'm here, and waiting for you
Quote:
When did the entire staff die?


Presumably, when they got possessed shortly after being pulled over.

Quote:
Does that mean Kaufmann is already dead, too? Dahlia?


You know this isn't the case. Strawmen are fail.

_________________
BlackFire2 wrote:
I thought he meant the special powers of her vagina.


Top
   
 

Woodside Apartments Janitor
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 12 Jan 2007
Notes left: 1196
Last seen at: Night Springs
Is the death of the entire staff present in some form of note or something in other Silent Hills?

_________________
Image


Top
   
 

Just Passing Through
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 23 Nov 2007
Notes left: 89
Last seen at: Silent Hill
4&20DeadBirds wrote:
Well Lisa does say "I'm the same as them I just hadn't noticed it before"
So is she already dead and she has a parasite we just can't see on her back?
But why is Kaufmann not dead? I'm trying to see consistancy here but it's difficult for me from all angles.


There was no parasite attached to Lisa at any point of the game. The only "parasite" character is Cybil, who ended up either getting killed or saved. When Lisa went down into the basement, she realized that she was the exact same as the others in the hospital, (dead). Lisa was dead since the beginning, and Kaufmann never really comes to the realization of his own death, and is instead punished by a raging mad Lisa.

As seen at the end of the game, Lisa crawls up from the floor grating, and drags Kaufmann back down with her. This probably means he is getting just as much torture as Lisa is getting.

_________________
You’re a rock star everybody wants you, Player… who can really blame you?


Top
   
 

Historical Society Historian
 Post subject:

Missing since: 15 Jul 2003
Notes left: 2368
Chloe Smith wrote:
There was no parasite attached to Lisa at any point of the game.

There have been several attempts to explain this. One is that the parasite burrowed itself in Lisa's head as evident by the way she bleeds in Nowhere, and, two, the Seal of Metatron may have removed the parasite from her body, but not before the damage was already done.

The idea that Lisa being a puppet nurse, or at least that a parasite killed her comes from some logical reasoning. The otherworld hospital is peculiar unlike the rest of the otherworld in the fact that there is no other monster besides the puppets themselves and the blood sucker, which is harmless as long as one doesn't get close to it. An army of parasites are the likely culprit that would have killed off the entire staff.

In order for Lisa's death to be consistent with all the other staff, she, too, should have been killed by a parasite.

Of course, it is possible, and widely believed that Kaufmann may have killed her due to any number of reasons. However, if that were true, it still leaves the question as to why Lisa's body ended up in the otherworld. The nurses and doctors are believed to have been killed in the otherworld; Lisa would have made an odd exception to the rule as she would be the only one who died in the real world and her body was thrown into the otherworld.

_________________
© 2003-2009 Burning Man.
The contents of this post may only be used within the boundaries of www.silenthillforum.com.
Any usage outside of the aforementioned forum is strictly prohibited.


Top
   
 

RESPECT
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
>There was no parasite attached to Lisa at any point of the game.
While this is true, theoretically Harry can kill puppet Lisa.

After Lisa's "transformation," Harry can reenter the storeroom. Lisa's body is no longer there. However, if you go further, and into the back room, a puppet nurse that previously was not there is present.

This also explains Droo's question of why the entirety of the staff looks the same.

I have another theory on the nurses' appearance as well, rooted in personal experience.

_________________
This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


Top
   
 

My Bestsellers Clerk
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 08 Nov 2008
Notes left: 357
Last seen at: Blackwater Park
MMY wrote:
After Lisa's "transformation," Harry can reenter the storeroom. Lisa's body is no longer there. However, if you go further, and into the back room, a puppet nurse that previously was not there is present.


But it's not Lisa, right? She still looks the same after the final battle, when she pulls Kaufmann into the Abyss. Just bloody/red.

_________________
there's comfort in silence


Top
   
 

Just Passing Through
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 23 Nov 2007
Notes left: 89
Last seen at: Silent Hill
Burning Man wrote:
Chloe Smith wrote:
There was no parasite attached to Lisa at any point of the game.

There have been several attempts to explain this. One is that the parasite burrowed itself in Lisa's head as evident by the way she bleeds in Nowhere, and, two, the Seal of Metatron may have removed the parasite from her body, but not before the damage was already done.

The idea that Lisa being a puppet nurse, or at least that a parasite killed her comes from some logical reasoning. The otherworld hospital is peculiar unlike the rest of the otherworld in the fact that there is no other monster besides the puppets themselves and the blood sucker, which is harmless as long as one doesn't get close to it. An army of parasites are the likely culprit that would have killed off the entire staff.

In order for Lisa's death to be consistent with all the other staff, she, too, should have been killed by a parasite.

Of course, it is possible, and widely believed that Kaufmann may have killed her due to any number of reasons. However, if that were true, it still leaves the question as to why Lisa's body ended up in the otherworld. The nurses and doctors are believed to have been killed in the otherworld; Lisa would have made an odd exception to the rule as she would be the only one who died in the real world and her body was thrown into the otherworld.


Lisa's "transformation" isn't really a transformation at all. It's Lisa becoming dead. She realized that she is just like the rest of the nurses and doctors roaming around in the hospital, and becomes bleeding as her mind lets her. The fact of the matter is, she's a ghost. A parasite would attach to a living host. There is no mention of Lisa having a parasite in the game, nor is there any reason to believe that there is in my mind. If a parasite were to be in her head, I would think it would sprout of something. The parasite would have expert timing to reveal itself and kill Lisa right after she tells Harry. Doesn't really connect in my mind.

Kaufmann is the most likely culprit of Lisa's demise. He was her drug supply, and she frequently rebelled and threatened to leave. He knew that she wouldn't leave, since she was addicted. The reason that Lisa's body is in the otherworld is due to her connection with Alessa in my mind. Either Alessa punished her by keeping her alive even though Alessa wasn't getting any better, and her wounds wouldn't heal, but each day Lisa would take care of something that doesn't get better.

_________________
You’re a rock star everybody wants you, Player… who can really blame you?


Top
   
 

RESPECT
 Post subject:
     
         
  User avatar  
     
     

Missing since: 19 Jul 2003
Notes left: 19401
Last seen at: #lfk
We know from Silent Hill 3 that Lisa is taken to the otherworld and tormented eternally. We also know that Valtiel is responsible for preparing the monsters for metempsychosis.

Perhaps Lisa already was.

>It's Lisa becoming dead.
Lisa is already dead.

_________________
This post is the property of its author and is not to be used elsewhere without explicit permission from the author.

. . . AND THAT'S THAT.


Top
   
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 284 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 ... 15  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: